[kictanet] What should the Investment Policy Be?

Fri Oct 17 13:59:27 EAT 2008

Plse lets hear more opinions on this issue. I heard one opinion that in the vent local investors are unable to raise funding, we could allow the foreing investor get in at 100% ownership on condition that they offload 20% to local investors within  3-5years.  Is this workable?

Yet another opinion was that local investors do have the funds - its just NOT structured i.e. well consolidated and cordinated. I think this may also be true if the recent Safaricom IPO is anything to go by. So it looks like we do have the funds for ICT investments while at the same time we dont! Where is the catch, bottleneck? How could this be resolved?

walu.
--- On Fri, 10/17/08, bitange at jambo.co.ke <bitange at jambo.co.ke> wrote:

> From: bitange at jambo.co.ke <bitange at jambo.co.ke>
> Subject: What should the Investment Policy Be?
> To: jwalu at yahoo.com
> Cc: bitange at jambo.co.ke, "KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions" <kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke>
> Date: Friday, October 17, 2008, 11:22 AM
> Dear Listers,
> A number of you have written to me off-list seeking to know
> the
> organizations that have sought excemption from the 20%
> local equity
> partcipation.
> 
> These are four of the World's largets call centers and
> two ICT equipment
> manufacturers.  They have said very clearly that they do
> not want to go
> through what some of the investors in telecoms sector went
> through or are
> going through.  By this they mean local
> "Investors" who fail to raise
> their part of the bargain.  We failed thrice to get the SNO
> simply because
> our local investors could not live up to their promises
> (Vtel, Reliance
> etc).  This is an annormally in the current policy that
> does not allow the
> investor to seek for another local investor in the event of
> a disagreement
> in the first marriage (Do not read Econet since law is
> never applied
> retrospectively).
> 
> Any progressive policy would give a chance to other people
> instead of
> forcing investors to stay in a marriage that does not bear
> fruit.  You
> recall in past meeting we have called for such investments
> to seek for
> partnership at the stock exchange.  This would mean then
> that the current
> policy is changed to allow that in the event there is a
> disagreement, the
> foreign investor can seek for a nother partner or better go
> to the stock
> market.
> 
> My responsibility among others is to ensure that we achieve
> vision 2030
> objectives as presicribed in the vision.  In order to
> achieve the targets,
> especially of getting at least 50,000 youth into BPO sector
> in the next
> three years, we must get these bigies.  This is what
> Ireland, India and
> Philipines did.
> 
> Regards
> 
> 
> Ndemo.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> > Hey Folks,
> >
> > I have lurked in the background for a while and like
> Wainaina I got a bit
> > lost in the exchanges.  But I think one fundamental
> thread in all this -
> > despite the muddy exchanges - is the question of how
> do want to engage
> > with Foreign Investors?  JM and others may have a
> point here - despite
> > their strong language.
> >
> > So maybe to bring benefit out of all these, we could
> indulge for a day or
> > two on the Policy we want as far as Foreign Direct
> Investments (FDI) into
> > our ICT industry are concerned.
> >
> > Correct me if am wrong but I believe the Government
> position/policy on
> > this has been that the Foreign investor MUST
> incorporate a local investor
> > at minimum ratio 20%(local) to 80%(foreign)
> ownership/equity.  I think the
> > members who feel that this should be changed have
> cases/examples where the
> > local equity/investor failed to come up with their 20%
> capital and so the
> > opportunity for investment disappears. On the other
> hand, other members
> > feel that local investors are abundantly rich and can
> come up with even
> > over 50% of any capital/equity required to invest in
> the industry.
> >
> > I honestly dont know which side is right and which one
> is wrong - but what
> > I do know is that there exists cases where the local
> investors have failed
> > to meet their capital requirements - hence the need to
> review or
> > interrogate whether this policy is detrimental or
> indeed beneficial to our
> > industry.
> >
> > Plse lets have objective comments that are devoid of
> personal attacks and
> > we shall make progress. Otherwise we begin to sound
> like a broken record.
> >
> > walu.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --- On Thu, 10/16/08, gachuhi anthony
> <gachuhi.anthony at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >> From: gachuhi anthony
> <gachuhi.anthony at gmail.com>
> >> Subject: Re: [kictanet] PS Ndemo, ECONET Scandal
> aand Vested Interests
> >> To: jwalu at yahoo.com
> >> Cc: "KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions"
> <kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke>
> >> Date: Thursday, October 16, 2008, 8:16 AM
> >> Moderator
> >> Is there a way off having an online poll to know
> where we
> >> stand maybe
> >> from there we may be able to know who is for or
> against the
> >> policies
> >> being discussed.
> >> Then we can give reasons as I don't think this
> a list
> >> to decide who is
> >> more kenyan than the other its about what will
> affect us
> >> all
> >> Tony
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On 10/16/08, Wainaina Mungai
> >> <wainaina at madeinkenya.org> wrote:
> >> > Dear all,
> >> >
> >> > What is the desired outcome of this very
> energised
> >> thread? (Select one)
> >> >
> >> > A: That the PS (I&C) announce that
> policies shall
> >> be developed in an
> >> > open, transparent and consultative manner. He
> also
> >> must organise a
> >> > forum to kickstart non-emotive talks by
> mid-November.
> >> >
> >> > B: That PS Ndemo resigns and is replaced with
> a person
> >> of your choice.
> >> >
> >> > C: That the Econet licence, Kencall licence
> and
> >> related MoUs,
> >> > contracts signed by PS (I&C) be
> cancelled.
> >> >
> >> > D: That all stakeholders Govt., KICTANET,
> KIF, CA, etc
> >> organise an
> >> > "ICT Investment" policy forum to be
> held in
> >> Nairobi around mid-
> >> > November 2008.
> >> >
> >> > I hope this shall help us focus on defining
> and
> >> achieving a common
> >> > goal so that we desist from personal attacks
> on
> >> integrity, racial
> >> > profiling and so on...
> >> >
> >> > Good day,
> >> > Wainaina
> >> >
> >> > On 10/16/08, Joseph Manthi
> <jmanthi at gmail.com>
> >> wrote:
> >> >> Edith,There are some useful lessons - but
> these
> >> lessons do not include:
> >> >>
> >> >> 1. How to give away your national
> treasures - like
> >> bandwidth - to foreign
> >> >> entities just because they say they can
> not do any
> >> business with local
> >> >> entrepreneurs. In fact I know this for a
> fact, you
> >> would never get a
> >> >> license
> >> >> to operate in UAE if this was your
> argument.
> >> Further to this lesson I
> >> >> would
> >> >> like to point to these additional
> countries that
> >> would laugh you out of
> >> >> town
> >> >> if you made that argument - US (some
> businesses
> >> like Airline, Military and
> >> >> Defense, Telecommunications (not ISP),
> Radio &
> >> TV), India, Singapore,
> >> >> Malaysia, Taiwan, Hong Kong, China, the
> whole of
> >> Middle East, South
> >> >> Africa,
> >> >> Japan (especially Japan)
> >> >>
> >> >> 2. How not be conned. Kenya seems to
> heading there
> >> with its eyes opened.
> >> >> When a man approaches a woman, it would
> be a very
> >> stupid woman, who
> >> >> knowing
> >> >> what a man is capable of, to accept the
> BS that
> >> the man is feeding her.
> >> >> And
> >> >> if she does then she deserves what she
> gets. Kenya
> >> will get what it
> >> >> deserves
> >> >> and very soon. A good example is Russia
> and its
> >> oligarchs - all members of
> >> >> the Forbes Richest.
> >> >>
> >> >> 3. Great leadership is necessary to grow
> a
> >> country. A leadership with
> >> >> intestinal fortitude to say no under
> pressure. Top
> >> to bottom,
> >> >>
> >> >> 4. That the local mwananchi can invest in
> their
> >> own country and manage its
> >> >> growth
> >> >>
> >> >> 5. That a great nation looks upon its
> diaspora to
> >> grow it - a la Israel
> >> >> and
> >> >> India
> >> >>
> >> >> 6. That a great nation does not wait to
> be raped
> >> twice - We seem to be
> >> >> following a process that will guarantee
> our raping
> >> despite how Kenyan some
> >> >> members of this committee think they are.
> Its just
> >> a matter of time before
> >> >> they pick up their bags and leave. I
> really do not
> >> think that as a
> >> >> national
> >> >> planner I should be putting my eggs in
> that
> >> basket.
> >> >>
> >> >> Joe
> >> >>
> >> >> On Wed, Oct 15, 2008 at 4:55 PM,
> >> <eadera at idrc.or.ke> wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >>> Anyone has taken the time to
> thoroughly study
> >> the secret behind
> >> >>> Dubai's tremendous growth? (U.A.E
> in
> >> general). There are some useful
> >> >>> lessons!
> >> >>>
> >> >>>
> >> >>> >
> >> >>> >---- Original Message ----
> >> >>> >From: j.maina at ymail.com
> >> >>> >To: eadera at idrc.or.ke
> >> >>> >Subject: Re: [kictanet] Fwd:  PS
> Ndemo,
> >> ECONET Scandal aand Vested
> >> >>> >Interests
> >> >>> >Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2008 09:03:50
> -0700
> >> (PDT)
> >> >>> >
> >> >>> >>Lizette
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>> >>I think that you have
> racially
> >> inclined your mind.
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>> >>When did KENCALL directors
> become
> >> Kenyans? After getting good
> >> >>> >friends to bribe their way to
> this
> >> country. And let me tell you that
> >> >>> >the money the so called investors
> are
> >> using are Kenyan money not
> >> >>> >money from foreign banks.
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>> >>They have come and borrowed
> from
> >> Kenyan banks. How much does the
> >> >>> >most profitable telecomms
> companies leave
> >> in this country, very small
> >> >>> >amount. We have Telecomms
> companies which
> >> are on their marks. They
> >> >>> >have very inferior systems and
> dont
> >> actually deliver in service but
> >> >>> >make billions and run away with
> the
> >> billions.
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>> >>Dada Lizette, we know that
> there are
> >> Kenyans who are white, black
> >> >>> >coloured and all but know that I
> am a
> >> mixed race Kenyan and really
> >> >>> >sad when our brotehrs have to
> suffer
> >> because of bad policies from
> >> >>> >people like PS
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>> >>JM
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>> >>----- Original Message ----
> >> >>> >>From: Lizette Kraft
> >> <lfkraft at gmail.com>
> >> >>> >>To: j.maina at ymail.com
> >> >>> >>Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy
> Discussions
> >> <kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke>
> >> >>> >>Sent: Tuesday, October 14,
> 2008
> >> 1:52:07 PM
> >> >>> >>Subject: [kictanet] Fwd:  PS
> Ndemo,
> >> ECONET Scandal aand Vested
> >> >>> >Interests
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>> >>Just my two pennies worth
> here.
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>> >>Kenya is not an Island that
> it can
> >> survive on its own even through
> >> >>> >local investment. Most times we
> dont have
> >> the funds. I do agree
> >> >>> >though about the Government and
> banks not
> >> supporting local investors
> >> >>> >with loans etc. They must start
> giving
> >> them the opportunity to setup
> >> >>> >local expertise and turn them in
> money
> >> making ventures, if only they
> >> >>> >wouldn't fleece their own
> companies.
> >> Even America, the giant needs
> >> >>> >investors!!! You all have a valid
> point
> >> but use it for the best
> >> >>> >interests of Kenya and its people
> first
> >> and foremost. Not just self
> >> >>> >interest for the few.  And by the
> way
> >> Kenyans come in all shapes,
> >> >>> >sizes, COLOURS, and creed. So
> please
> >> don't generalise who is kenyan
> >> >>> >and who is not!!!  Kencall
> directors and
> >> owners are Kenyan and not
> >> >>> >outsiders if I understand
> correctly. When
> >> we are taxed whether
> >> >>> >individually or coorporately, the
> money is
> >> used for Kenya and Kenyans
> >> >>> >and not for outsiders who
> invested!
> >> Forcing local partnership in
> >> >>> >foreign owned companies has
> >> >>> >> its negative and positive
> effects.
> >> >>> >>This needs to be look at more
> >> seriously to make it a win-win
> >> >>> >situation. It has been known in
> the past
> >> that foreign investors with
> >> >>> >forced local partnership have
> been
> >> subjected to threats and
> >> >>> >intimidation by the local
> partners when
> >> they wanted more than their
> >> >>> >fare share, (given to them mind
> you). Thus
> >> the weariness o
> >> >>> >>of being forced now. This
> does not
> >> attract any investor. But the
> >> >>> >foreigners should not fleece the
> country
> >> either!
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>> >>Let us have some constructive
> >> critisism without being racially
> >> >>> >inclined. Fight to make things
> right no
> >> matter what but without
> >> >>> >pinpointing nationalities or
> colours of
> >> people.
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>> >>On 10/7/08, John Maina
> >> <j.maina at ymail.com> wrote:
> >> >>>
> >>
> >>http://www.wananchiforums.com/showthread.php?p=3150#poest3150
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>>
> >>
> >>_______________________________________________
> >> >>> >>kictanet mailing list
> >> >>> >>kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke
> >> >>>
> >>
> >>http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>> >>This message was sent to:
> >> lfkraft at gmail.com
> >> >>> >>Unsubscribe or change your
> options at
> >> >>>
> >>
> >http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/lfkraft%40gmail.
> >> >>> >com
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>> >>--
> >> >>> >>Lizette Kraft
> >> >>> >>P.O. Box 18488, 00500
> >> >>> >>Nairobi, Kenya
> >> >>> >>Cell: 0722-800362
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>>
> >> >>>
> >> >>>
> >> >>>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> >>> kictanet mailing list
> >> >>> kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke
> >> >>>
> >>
> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
> >> >>>
> >> >>> This message was sent to:
> jmanthi at gmail.com
> >> >>> Unsubscribe or change your options at
> >> >>>
> >>
> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/jmanthi%40gmail.com
> >> >>>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> --
> >> >> Joseph Manthi
> >> >> CEO
> >> >> MEO Ltd
> >> >> http://www.meoltd.com
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> > --
> >> > Sent from my mobile device
> >> >
> >> > Made in Kenya Network
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> >> > Cel:  +254-735-370840
> >> > www.madeinkenya.org
> >> >
> >> > http://www.bungesms.com
> >> >
> >> >
> _______________________________________________
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> >> >
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> >
> >
> >
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