[kictanet] the used computers debate

Mon Mar 15 13:37:04 EAT 2010

Thanks Barack and congratulations for earning a stint at the IGF offices
in Geneva. When are you leaving? I am sure you will be a wonderful
ambassador for us all. Best wishes.

On Mon, 15 Mar 2010 11:27 +0200, "Barrack Otieno"
<otieno.barrack at gmail.com> wrote:
> Daktari,
> 
> I think a stakeholders meeting on the above mentioned subject would be
> appropriate, we need to take stock of the impact of the
> computerization initiatives that is the gains we have made with the
> the refurbished computers, this could justify Ikua's position. Our
> good friend Prof Waema could guide us on how to conduct the research
> it could be an online research project, better still the Computer
> Society of Kenya can take up a challenge and possibly sponsor a town
> hall meeting (commission of inquiry).
> On another note are there any lessons we can learn from the "Nyayo"
> pioneer car ? it would be great for future generations, where are we
> at with e-mado?
> 
> Regards
> 
> On Mon, Mar 15, 2010 at 11:04 AM, waudo siganga <emailsignet at mailcan.com>
> wrote:
> > by the way what will happen to initiatives like Computers for Schools,
> > the ICT Trust, and others who have been doing an incredible job getting
> > ICT to the people via the "maligned" used refurbished computers?
> >
> > On Mon, 15 Mar 2010 03:15 -0500, ikua at lpakenya.org wrote:
> >> Thank you Kivuva for echoing my concerns.
> >>
> >> To answer you Dr Waudo, I don't agree with you that we are too busy.
> >> As much as I agree that the PS is quite available all round for
> >> consultation, my problem is the way these policy pronouncements appear
> >> in the media, with no visible option for recourse. When the PS
> >> announces in the media that he will ban used computers, it seems like
> >> the decision has already been made. That is what my complain was
> >> about. I wish he had invited industry players to give their views for
> >> or against such a drastic decision.
> >>
> >> I will actually seek to have an audience with him and try and make him
> >> see our side of the story, as we also try and understand where he is
> >> coming from. I believe he has the best interests of our country at
> >> heart, as we all do.
> >>
> >> Knowing that Dr. Ndemo will read this, please grant us an audience
> >> when we call your office.
> >>
> >> Regards,
> >> Ikua
> >>
> >>
> >> Quoting lordmwesh <lordmwesh at gmail.com>:
> >>
> >> >  As much as we want to be proud of ourselves, it's only fair  we realize
> >> > Kenya is a "developing third world" as the wabeberu likes to call us.
> >> >
> >> > In that regard, second hand items will always be part of us, cars,
> >> > computers, etc.
> >> >
> >> > Instead of issuing a total ban, we can grade the second hand electronic
> >> > equipments that get into the country, just like we do for cars. This will
> >> > not prevent 'contraband' computers getting into the market, just the way we
> >> > can't prevent illicit drugs, and cars older than 10years sneaking through
> >> > our ports, but at least will help in regulating the quality that gets in.
> >> >
> >> > Politics is a game of interest, but when making policies, we should always
> >> > look at the good interests of the whole county.
> >> >
> >> > PS Ndemo, and me can afford powerful new computers, but what about the
> >> > college kid who is learning how to code, or the estate entrepreneur who is
> >> > setting up a cyber?
> >> >
> >> > We all know that some new computer clones have poor performance than most
> >> > branded second hand imports.  For example, I have never been able to buy a
> >> > durable new keyboard or mouse, unless its part of a western branded new or
> >> > second hand computer. Maybe I don't know where to shop.
> >> >
> >> > Most of the techies in this list will agree that a western branded second
> >> > hand computer (HP, Dell, et al) with 2.5GHZ CPU, 1GB RAM, 80GB HDD, and a
> >> > TFT all costing roughly KES24,000, and are just as good for daily
> >> > applications
> >> >
> >> > Regards
> >> >
> >> > Mwendwa Kivuva
> >> > 0722402248
> >> >
> >> > ____________________
> >> > transworldAfrica.com | Fluent in computing
> >> > biblia.kenya.or.ke | A verse a day
> >> > kenya.or.ke | The Kenya we know
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > On 11 March 2010 10:51, Barrack Otieno <otieno.barrack at gmail.com> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> Colleagues,
> >> >>
> >> >> "In a recent report, Information permanent secretary Bitange Ndemo
> >> >> proposed a ban on used computer imports. This is good because of the
> >> >> growing threat posed by hazardous e-waste from used electronic
> >> >> equipment ? computers, mobile phones, television sets and even
> >> >> fridges."
> >> >>
> >> >> This is just a proposal, i agree with Mr. Ikua there is
> >> >> misrepresentation of facts, let us focus on access for all and if used
> >> >> computers can address this issue then they should be permitted,
> >> >> ikssues of e-waste can be handled by KEBS, i am aware of the fact that
> >> >> there are vested interests in the whole issue, if we are not careful
> >> >> we will continue playing second fiddle to Europe and other continents
> >> >> I am sickened by the fact that we are are mostly "resellers" and
> >> >> "consumers"(peripheral roles) access is what will stimulate knowledge
> >> >> transfer hence innovation. We need a stakeholder meeting before the
> >> >> ban is effected if at all it will be effected and possibly a
> >> >> referendum on the matter.
> >> >>
> >> >> Thank you
> >> >>
> >> >> On Wed, Mar 10, 2010 at 5:42 PM, waudo siganga <emailsignet at mailcan.com>
> >> >> wrote:
> >> >> > Evans - I am also sad regarding this ban but I have to unfortunately
> >> >> > challenge you. I think we need to blame ourselves in the industry rather
> >> >> > than the Ministry because we are too busy with too many things to
> >> >> > properly engage the Ministry. I believe the Ministry has an open-door
> >> >> > policy and even the PS has agreed to be on this list which is
> >> >> > commendable. You and I run associations that engage in Public Policy
> >> >> > advocacy. Can you tell us what exactly your association has done to
> >> >> > predict this development and what engagement you have had with the
> >> >> > Ministry on the issue which was then dis-regarded when the decision was
> >> >> > made?  I know my association has not attended to this issue mainly
> >> >> > because we are attending to too many things - so we need to proceed from
> >> >> > there before blaming the Ministry.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Waudo
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > On Tue, 09 Mar 2010 01:39 -0600, ikua at lpakenya.org wrote:
> >> >> >> So we are back to this debate about used computers. seems like the
> >> >> >> Ministry will not relent on this.
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> The story in the business daily has a lot of misinformation and half
> >> >> >> truths coming from the Ministry. To say that the price of new
> >> >> >> computers has come down to affordable levels is to be economical with
> >> >> >> the truth. How much is a new Dell or HP computer? About 45k. The lower
> >> >> >> priced models like Mecer or Acer will go for about 35k and above for
> >> >> >> standard specs.
> >> >> >> How about a new clone? About 25k. And the lifespan of a new clone?
> >> >> >> About 3 years, 4 if you are lucky. The warranty on new clones is only
> >> >> >> 3 months. Used/refurbished computers can give the user upwards of 5
> >> >> >> years in good use. Between a new clone made with cheap parts from
> >> >> >> China and a used computer of a major brand, I would go for the used
> >> >> >> computer.
> >> >> >> With 10k, you have a good low spec used computer. So as a student or a
> >> >> >> home user, you get easy access to technology. With 15k, you have a
> >> >> >> powerful used computer with specs like P4 3.0/512mb RAM/80gb HDD. So
> >> >> >> as a small business which needs to buy 10 computers, or a school or
> >> >> >> college that needs to buy 40 computers, what would you go for with a
> >> >> >> limited budget?
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> Why cant the government regulate the trade in used computers instead
> >> >> >> of imposing a total ban? The industry will still have jobs for IT
> >> >> >> technicians, whether its used computers or its assembly of clones.
> >> >> >> which leads m,e to the question, what happened to the eMado computer?
> >> >> >> How is it doing as a business proposition? How many have been sold and
> >> >> >> to whom? How much is it? How many components are being manufactured in
> >> >> >> Kenya?
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> We can for instance say  that we will not accept into the country a
> >> >> >> computer manufactured over 5 years ago, or 8 years, like motor
> >> >> >> vehicles. Or that we will not accept computers below a certain speed.
> >> >> >> Clones have much more ewaste than used computers as they die faster.
> >> >> >> Yet new branded computers are way beyond the reach of the common
> >> >> >> mwananchi. but again, this has never been about the common mwananchi,
> >> >> >> inasmuch as noone sees the need to find out what he thinks about such
> >> >> >> policy decisions.
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> Regards,
> >> >> >> Ikua
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> _______________________________________________
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> >> >> >
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> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> --
> >> >> Barrack O. Otieno
> >> >> Administrative Manager
> >> >> Afriregister Ltd (Ke)
> >> >> P.o.Box 21682
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> >> >> Tel:
> >> >> +254721325277
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> >> >> +254202498789
> >> >> Riara Road, Bamboo Lane
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> >> >>
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> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
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> >> >
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
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> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Barrack O. Otieno
> Administrative Manager
> Afriregister Ltd (Ke)
> P.o.Box 21682
> Nairobi 00100
> Tel:
> +254721325277
> +254733206359
> +254202498789
> Riara Road, Bamboo Lane
> www.afriregister.com
> www.afriregister.co.ke
> ICANN accredited registrar.
> Skype: barrack.otieno
> 