[kictanet] the used computers debate

Mon Mar 15 12:27:12 EAT 2010

Daktari,

I think a stakeholders meeting on the above mentioned subject would be
appropriate, we need to take stock of the impact of the
computerization initiatives that is the gains we have made with the
the refurbished computers, this could justify Ikua's position. Our
good friend Prof Waema could guide us on how to conduct the research
it could be an online research project, better still the Computer
Society of Kenya can take up a challenge and possibly sponsor a town
hall meeting (commission of inquiry).
On another note are there any lessons we can learn from the "Nyayo"
pioneer car ? it would be great for future generations, where are we
at with e-mado?

Regards

On Mon, Mar 15, 2010 at 11:04 AM, waudo siganga <emailsignet at mailcan.com> wrote:
> by the way what will happen to initiatives like Computers for Schools,
> the ICT Trust, and others who have been doing an incredible job getting
> ICT to the people via the "maligned" used refurbished computers?
>
> On Mon, 15 Mar 2010 03:15 -0500, ikua at lpakenya.org wrote:
>> Thank you Kivuva for echoing my concerns.
>>
>> To answer you Dr Waudo, I don't agree with you that we are too busy.
>> As much as I agree that the PS is quite available all round for
>> consultation, my problem is the way these policy pronouncements appear
>> in the media, with no visible option for recourse. When the PS
>> announces in the media that he will ban used computers, it seems like
>> the decision has already been made. That is what my complain was
>> about. I wish he had invited industry players to give their views for
>> or against such a drastic decision.
>>
>> I will actually seek to have an audience with him and try and make him
>> see our side of the story, as we also try and understand where he is
>> coming from. I believe he has the best interests of our country at
>> heart, as we all do.
>>
>> Knowing that Dr. Ndemo will read this, please grant us an audience
>> when we call your office.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Ikua
>>
>>
>> Quoting lordmwesh <lordmwesh at gmail.com>:
>>
>> >  As much as we want to be proud of ourselves, it's only fair  we realize
>> > Kenya is a "developing third world" as the wabeberu likes to call us.
>> >
>> > In that regard, second hand items will always be part of us, cars,
>> > computers, etc.
>> >
>> > Instead of issuing a total ban, we can grade the second hand electronic
>> > equipments that get into the country, just like we do for cars. This will
>> > not prevent 'contraband' computers getting into the market, just the way we
>> > can't prevent illicit drugs, and cars older than 10years sneaking through
>> > our ports, but at least will help in regulating the quality that gets in.
>> >
>> > Politics is a game of interest, but when making policies, we should always
>> > look at the good interests of the whole county.
>> >
>> > PS Ndemo, and me can afford powerful new computers, but what about the
>> > college kid who is learning how to code, or the estate entrepreneur who is
>> > setting up a cyber?
>> >
>> > We all know that some new computer clones have poor performance than most
>> > branded second hand imports.  For example, I have never been able to buy a
>> > durable new keyboard or mouse, unless its part of a western branded new or
>> > second hand computer. Maybe I don't know where to shop.
>> >
>> > Most of the techies in this list will agree that a western branded second
>> > hand computer (HP, Dell, et al) with 2.5GHZ CPU, 1GB RAM, 80GB HDD, and a
>> > TFT all costing roughly KES24,000, and are just as good for daily
>> > applications
>> >
>> > Regards
>> >
>> > Mwendwa Kivuva
>> > 0722402248
>> >
>> > ____________________
>> > transworldAfrica.com | Fluent in computing
>> > biblia.kenya.or.ke | A verse a day
>> > kenya.or.ke | The Kenya we know
>> >
>> >
>> > On 11 March 2010 10:51, Barrack Otieno <otieno.barrack at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >> Colleagues,
>> >>
>> >> "In a recent report, Information permanent secretary Bitange Ndemo
>> >> proposed a ban on used computer imports. This is good because of the
>> >> growing threat posed by hazardous e-waste from used electronic
>> >> equipment ? computers, mobile phones, television sets and even
>> >> fridges."
>> >>
>> >> This is just a proposal, i agree with Mr. Ikua there is
>> >> misrepresentation of facts, let us focus on access for all and if used
>> >> computers can address this issue then they should be permitted,
>> >> ikssues of e-waste can be handled by KEBS, i am aware of the fact that
>> >> there are vested interests in the whole issue, if we are not careful
>> >> we will continue playing second fiddle to Europe and other continents
>> >> I am sickened by the fact that we are are mostly "resellers" and
>> >> "consumers"(peripheral roles) access is what will stimulate knowledge
>> >> transfer hence innovation. We need a stakeholder meeting before the
>> >> ban is effected if at all it will be effected and possibly a
>> >> referendum on the matter.
>> >>
>> >> Thank you
>> >>
>> >> On Wed, Mar 10, 2010 at 5:42 PM, waudo siganga <emailsignet at mailcan.com>
>> >> wrote:
>> >> > Evans - I am also sad regarding this ban but I have to unfortunately
>> >> > challenge you. I think we need to blame ourselves in the industry rather
>> >> > than the Ministry because we are too busy with too many things to
>> >> > properly engage the Ministry. I believe the Ministry has an open-door
>> >> > policy and even the PS has agreed to be on this list which is
>> >> > commendable. You and I run associations that engage in Public Policy
>> >> > advocacy. Can you tell us what exactly your association has done to
>> >> > predict this development and what engagement you have had with the
>> >> > Ministry on the issue which was then dis-regarded when the decision was
>> >> > made?  I know my association has not attended to this issue mainly
>> >> > because we are attending to too many things - so we need to proceed from
>> >> > there before blaming the Ministry.
>> >> >
>> >> > Waudo
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > On Tue, 09 Mar 2010 01:39 -0600, ikua at lpakenya.org wrote:
>> >> >> So we are back to this debate about used computers. seems like the
>> >> >> Ministry will not relent on this.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> The story in the business daily has a lot of misinformation and half
>> >> >> truths coming from the Ministry. To say that the price of new
>> >> >> computers has come down to affordable levels is to be economical with
>> >> >> the truth. How much is a new Dell or HP computer? About 45k. The lower
>> >> >> priced models like Mecer or Acer will go for about 35k and above for
>> >> >> standard specs.
>> >> >> How about a new clone? About 25k. And the lifespan of a new clone?
>> >> >> About 3 years, 4 if you are lucky. The warranty on new clones is only
>> >> >> 3 months. Used/refurbished computers can give the user upwards of 5
>> >> >> years in good use. Between a new clone made with cheap parts from
>> >> >> China and a used computer of a major brand, I would go for the used
>> >> >> computer.
>> >> >> With 10k, you have a good low spec used computer. So as a student or a
>> >> >> home user, you get easy access to technology. With 15k, you have a
>> >> >> powerful used computer with specs like P4 3.0/512mb RAM/80gb HDD. So
>> >> >> as a small business which needs to buy 10 computers, or a school or
>> >> >> college that needs to buy 40 computers, what would you go for with a
>> >> >> limited budget?
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Why cant the government regulate the trade in used computers instead
>> >> >> of imposing a total ban? The industry will still have jobs for IT
>> >> >> technicians, whether its used computers or its assembly of clones.
>> >> >> which leads m,e to the question, what happened to the eMado computer?
>> >> >> How is it doing as a business proposition? How many have been sold and
>> >> >> to whom? How much is it? How many components are being manufactured in
>> >> >> Kenya?
>> >> >>
>> >> >> We can for instance say  that we will not accept into the country a
>> >> >> computer manufactured over 5 years ago, or 8 years, like motor
>> >> >> vehicles. Or that we will not accept computers below a certain speed.
>> >> >> Clones have much more ewaste than used computers as they die faster.
>> >> >> Yet new branded computers are way beyond the reach of the common
>> >> >> mwananchi. but again, this has never been about the common mwananchi,
>> >> >> inasmuch as noone sees the need to find out what he thinks about such
>> >> >> policy decisions.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Regards,
>> >> >> Ikua
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
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>> >> >
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>> >>
>> >>
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