[kictanet] ICT ASSOCIATIONS MERGER
Harry Delano
harry at comtelsys.co.ke
Thu Apr 8 08:36:25 EAT 2010
Hey Charles,
This is quite a good initiative - however, it may also seem not so many
people within this fraternity might be aware of the Federation. It would be
good to sensitize and create an awareness regarding the role & objective of
each specific organization we come up with. Looks to me this whole thing of
"splinter" groups just bedevills almost every section of the society. Maybe
so that we keep this whole debate focused and on course, let's have all the
'would-be' stakeholders, participating in such forums as "Kictanet", and the
rest who are like-minded in their individual capacity - engage Govt, and
other sectors, and deal..
This should foster progress, so that we do not let enclaves cloud up this
noble purpose..
Harry
-----Original Message-----
From: charles nduati [mailto:charlesnduati2002 at yahoo.co.uk]
Sent: Thursday, April 08, 2010 6:49 AM
To: harry at comtelsys.co.ke; bm at jkuates.jkuat.ac.ke
Cc: kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke
Subject: Re: [kictanet] ICT ASSOCIATIONS MERGER
Hi listers,
I have truly enjoyed this debate especially having been the first founding
executive director of KENYA ICT FEDERATION (KIF) With other industry
captains like mike eldon our founder chairman and all chairmen of the then
12 existing ICT associations i.e. 2003. our vision was exactly what this
debate is about and we anchored KIF under KEPSA. as Dr. siganga said, there
is no need of recreating the wheel. just contact Dr. kevit desai the KIF
governor at KEPSA and ask him to adopt all ICT associations and stakeholders
in KEPSA through KIF.
believe me folks, if the ROMAN KING CONSTANTINE hadn t merged all christian
sects and made himself the first POPE, christianity would not have survived
2000 years and be so successful in its mission
good day all
charles nduati
On Wed, 07 Apr 2010 21:34 EEST Harry Delano wrote:
>Al Kags,
>
>That is why this town hall meeting may be important. Actually Harry
>(Hare), came up with a more brilliant idea that would require us to
>make this to be more of an evaluation process
>- that would create a "need" for
>either overhaul or improvement in structures and processes. This could
>be enacted by Govt, either through legislation, or an executive
>decision.
>
>Mr. Kukubo, also had a good suggestion that we cast the net wider, to
>draw in as many stakeholers as we can. This, I suppose would be be a
>perfect chance for us, to tick each of these agencies off the list,
>enumerating their roles, mandate, and how this all should fit in the
>bigger picture across the national ICT Landscape. I suppose, we need to
>hold to account those tasked with a mandate..
>
>So I suppose, the question we should be asking ourselves, is where do
>we first start - The town hall meeting..?
>And how do we cast this net wider for participation..?
>
>Harry
>
> _____
>
>From: kictanet-bounces+harry=comtelsys.co.ke at lists.kictanet.or.ke
>[mailto:kictanet-bounces+harry=comtelsys.co.ke at lists.kictanet.or.ke] On
>Behalf Of Al Kags
>Sent: Wednesday, April 07, 2010 8:45 PM
>To: harry at comtelsys.co.ke
>Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions
>Subject: Re: [kictanet] Who is ICT Board? Hijacked
>
>
>Gilda, you are right that all organisations need to meet their
>obligations effectively. I wonder though whether some of them are not
duplicated?
>especially some that we have seen listed on this thread?
>
>
>On Wed, Apr 7, 2010 at 4:40 PM, <godera at skyweb.co.ke> wrote:
>
>
>
>Hi Harry,
>
>I believe the various organisations are all playing their own unique roles.
>Key thing is for each to meet it's obligations effectively.
>Tim Waema's proposal on the discussion of various organisations and
>their mandate is no doubt a good idea to get things cleared and for
>industry to continue giving their input so that the organisations are well
designed.
>
>Best,
>
>Gilda
>
>
>Quoting Harry Delano <harry at comtelsys.co.ke>:
>
>>
>> S. Murigi,
>>
>> Hey is it an ipad you typing on....?? Anyways, just on a lighter note...
>>
>> So, what could be the best way forward? It seems, we just got a whole
>myriad
>> of organizations out here, some of them I'm hearing for the 1st time..
>>
>> Harry
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: kictanet-bounces+harry=comtelsys.co.ke at lists.kictanet.or.ke
>> [mailto:kictanet-bounces+harry <mailto:kictanet-bounces%2Bharry>
>=comtelsys.co.ke at lists.kictanet.or.ke] On
>> Behalf Of S.Murigi Muraya
>> Sent: Wednesday, April 07, 2010 3:25 PM
>> To: harry at comtelsys.co.ke
>> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions
>> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Who is ICT Board? Hijacked
>>
>> About 2 years ago went to the KICTB offices then at Waiyaki Way. My
>purpose
>> then was to find out what they were about.
>>
>> Was referred to a visibly irritated fellow who was done with me in
>> less
>than
>> 1 minute only telling me to check the KICTB website.
>>
>> Have waited to see what they would come up with and am not too
>disappointed.
>> For one they organize, co sponsor or market industry events that
>> yuppies
>can
>> be involved in without falling asleep. Being sort of experienced in
>> the professional tech skills development field this can
>> authoritatively say
>this
>> is one of the 'enabling situations' we have lacked locally.
>>
>> We need skills but companies are not willing to train unethical
>> techies
>who
>> jump ship immediately after being sharpened. On the other hand
>> techies are unable to effectively educate themselves without
>> corporate or tech
>community
>> support eg. www.ihub.co.ke
>>
>> Training centers are not too doing well financially & cannot hire the
>> best (often more experienced) techies because corporates are not
>> training as
>much
>> as they should. By working with industry giants (eg Google,
>> Microsoft,
>> Oracle) & their partners the KICTB is somehow helping educate techies
>> via these industry events.
>>
>> If anything, the KICTB needs to exist for this purpose -> to help
>> build capacity in the local tech industry. They are exposing budding
>> software entreprenuers to Indian outsourcing practices to name another
'situation'
>> they are enabling. GITS, NCS etc do not do this as far as I know.
>>
>> Nimechoka - typing on a mobile.
>>
>> SMM
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Barrack Otieno <otieno.barrack at gmail.com>
>> Sent: Monday, April 05, 2010 16:52
>> To: murigi.muraya at gmail.com
>> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke>
>> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Who is ICT Board? Hijacked
>>
>> Dr. Siganga,
>>
>> Your write up makes sense, i guess we have been mixing too many
>> issues,
>in
>> other words we handle government agencies and industry associations
>> separately, sounds like the meeting is a welcome idea, i suggest
>government
>> agencies first.
>>
>> Regards
>>
>> On Mon, Apr 5, 2010 at 3:03 PM, waudo siganga
>> <emailsignet at mailcan.com>
>> wrote:
>> > Hi Evans, all - we have discussed the issue of a statutory body to
>> > regulate ICT professionalism on this list in the past and the
>> > discussion did not go far. Some said that we would be interfering
>> > with "innovation". Some mentioned Bill Gates as a guy who has done
>> > much but does not have any professional qualification. Yet others
>> > had other stories (e.g. the three blind men story from Brian and
>> > his note to Walu on 7/7/08:
>> >> I beg to differ. ICT is too large, too deep and too wide to have a
>> >> single, authoritative, representative body. What you refer to
>> >> would probably be more appropriate to some of the professional
>> >> disciplines within the ICT sector e.g. Software Developers Guild,
>> >> System Administrators Association, CIO/CTO Society - within which
>> >> there can be certain codes of behavior, ethics, values, best practices
etc...
>> >
>> > On 10/9/08 on this list I re-introduced the topic of a statutory
>> > body such as LSK,ICPAK, ... to guide the ICT profession. In my mail
>> > I even included a "draft ICT Professionals Act". The idea received
>> > cold water except from Kamotho.
>> >
>> > One distinction between "profession" and "Industry". In my mind I
>> > see statutory bodies as more regulating "profession" rather than
"industry".
>> > Industry bodies are normally private sector initiatives formed by
>> > interested persons to achieve common goals. I can be surprised to
>> > hear the government being asked to help set up an "industry"
>> > association of any type. Private sector associations engage the
>> > government, so how can the same government be involved in their set
>> > up? The other axiomatic thing about associations is that the ones
>> > that do not deliver invariably die a natural death - and there are
>> > many examples of this in Kenya even within ICT. It is not difficult
>> > to set up a membership association (just like a Church or Club
>> > which are set up
>under
>> the same "Societies Act").
>> > People cannot be stopped from setting up associations because the
>> > Constitution guarantees freedom of association. This means those
>> > who have any bright ideas that are not accommodated by existing
>> > associations cannot have an excuse or choose to take up the role of
>> > professional hecklers of existing associations.
>> >
>> > Within ICT we agreed some years to accommodate multiple
>> > associations which then converge under KEPSA umbrella to offer a
unified voice.
>> > This I think is working very well as recently exemplified at the
>> > Prime Minister's Round Table where ICT issues were very well
articulated.
>> >
>> > With regard to Prof's suggestion to discuss government agencies and
>> > private sector associations at the same meeting I think that would
>> > create much confusion and even opportunities for red herrings to be
>> > thrown around. It is mixing oranges and apples. The word "association"
>> > is actually a short form. The exact terminology is "membership
>> > association". An association is made up of members who voluntarily
>> > come together and run their interests. The members have their own
>> > channels to discuss their issues. It does not take much imagination
>> > to realize that someone who is NOT a "member" is unlikely to have
>> > overflowing goodwill towards (leave alone information about) the
>> > association. However, associations face a lot of challenges and a
>> > specific get together of associations to discuss best practices and
>> > ways of being sustainable and more effective would be welcome. The
>> > Business Advocacy Fund is for example doing a great and positive
>> > job in the direction of capacity building and funding. Well done to
them.
>> > Another useful type of meeting is the type you refer to that was
>> > held at KICC a couple of years ago where associations can inform a
>> > wider audience about their activities and roles and, perhaps,
>> > recruit more
>> members. Overall, an associations'
>> > meeting should be a focused one and not be mixed up with one for
>> > government agencies; and guest list should be expanded from Prof's
>> > limiting suggestion of "the plethora of ICT industry associations
>> > that are not effective" to include those which are effective so
>> > that others can learn from them as well.
>> >
>> > Waudo
>> > www.cskonline.org
>> >
>> >
>> > On Mon, 05 Apr 2010 02:38 -0500, ikua at lpakenya.org wrote:
>> >> Dear listers,
>> >> Did we not have a similar meeting not too long ago? I think it was
>> >> about two years or so. Cant remember who had organized it but it
>> >> was there at KICC. Same theme of taking stock of all ICT bodies.
>> >> Cant remember if the Government agencies were represented.
>> >>
>> >> Not that I have a problem with yet another similar meeting, but we
>> >> need to clearly set out what we want to achieve with that kind of
>> >> gathering. Its common knowledge that the ICT industry is awash
>> >> with all manner of associations/organizations and Government
>> >> bodies. Isn't it time that we had the sort of organization that we
>> >> see with other professions like Accountants and Lawyers etc? Isn't
>> >> it time that the Government created a statutory industry
>> >> association? This can easily be achieved by such legislation as
>> >> the policy document presented by the PS the other day, or the
>> >> Communications Act that was passed not too long ago.
>> >>
>> >> Inasmuch as the Government so believes in the increasing
>> >> importance that ICT plays in the economy, then its imperative that
>> >> we have an industry body that would take care of all others, say
>> >> like a CSK that is recognized by an Act of parliament.
>> >>
>> >> Regards,
>> >> Ikua
>> >>
>> >> Quoting Mwololo Tim <timwololo at gmail.com>:
>> >>
>> >> > Dear all,
>> >> > The discussion needs to be on the institutional framework for
>> >> > ICTs in Kenya, not just on KICTB. It needs to cover KICTB, NCS
>> >> > and DEG/GITS. It also needs to include the plethora of ICT
>> >> > industry
>> associations that are not effective.
>> >> > I can organize such a townhall meeting in Chiromo like the first
one.
>> >> > However, for such a meeting to be useful, it needs to be
>> >> > preceded by some guided discussion on the same. Alternatively,
>> >> > one or two persons can prepare presenations to guide the
>> >> > discussions, with these presentations being made available
>> >> > earlier for participants to acquint with them. I am also
>> >> > prepared to be one of those persons. tim
>> >> >
>> >> > On Sun, Apr 4, 2010 at 9:10 PM, Barrack Otieno
>> >> > <otieno.barrack at gmail.com>wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> >> Daktari,
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Thank you for setting the ball rolling, not sure i saw the
>> >> >> document as well it must have been hijacked. A town hall
>> >> >> meeting is a welcome idea i second it, Kippra felt sufficiently
>> >> >> philanthropic before the last town hall meeting i wonder
>> >> >> whether they can double their offer during this easter season,
>> >> >> bwn Magolo can we count on you. Walu can set the agenda.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Regards
>> >> >>
>> >> >> On Sun, Apr 4, 2010 at 7:28 PM, Solomon Mburu Kamau
>> >> >> <solo.mburu at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >> >> > On 04/04/2010, bitange at jambo.co.ke <bitange at jambo.co.ke> wrote:
>> >> >> >> Barrack,
>> >> >> >> Several posts have come by on the role of ICT and I think it
>> >> >> >> will be
>> >> >> wise
>> >> >> >> if we sorted this in a town hall meeting similar to one we
>> >> >> >> had on
>> >> >> Malili.
>> >> >> >> Honestly it feels as though some Neanderthal decided to
>> >> >> >> create these agencies without putting some thought to it.
>> >> >> >> Criticisms are good only when you point out where there are
gaps.
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> The other day I posted a policy proposal for comments but
>> >> >> >> only one
>> >> >> person
>> >> >> >> did respond. What it means then is that this forum ni ya
>> >> >> >> kuchongoana
>> >> >> tu.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Dakitari, with due respect, would you mind resending the
>> >> >> > policy proposals as a new thread so that interested parties may
respond?
>> >> >> > If sent within this thread, I'm afraid they'll be swallowed
>> >> >> > along the
>> >> >> way.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >> Which really is unfortunate. I have four other policy
>> >> >> >> proposals that I really think should push through then
>> >> >> >> arouse sufficient interest from
>> >> >> the
>> >> >> >> membership here.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > I also think you should send them so that we react to the
>contents!
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Ndemo.
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>> This is truly "Jicho Pevu", i think some answers to this
>> >> >> >>> questions are very much in order as we celebrate Easter,
>> >> >> >>> can someone provide us with a list of all agencies involved
>> >> >> >>> in ICTs and ICT4D so that we can do some tooth comb
>> >> >> >>> analysis, i saw a post from Paul on what the board has
>> >> >> >>> achieved early this year, that was very much in order we
>> >> >> >>> need something from
>NCS
>> as well plus any other agencies.
>> >> >> >>>
>> >> >> >>> Regards
>> >> >> >>>
>> >> >> >>> On Sat, Apr 3, 2010 at 12:50 PM, Vitalis Olunga
>> >> >> >>> <volunga at yahoo.com>
>> >> >> wrote:
>> >> >> >>>> There is also another body , National Communications
>> >> >> >>>> Secretarait. What is the diffrence between NCS and ICT
>> >> >> >>>> Baord and how do the two bodies
>> >> >> relate
>> >> >> >>>> with respect to advisory services to the governement on
>> >> >> >>>> ICT
>> matters?
>> >> >> >>>>
>> >> >> >>>> Regards
>> >> >> >>>>
>> >> >> >>>>
>> >> >> >>>> Vitalis
>> >> >> >>>>
>> >> >> >>>> ________________________________
>> >> >> >>>> From: robert yawe <robertyawe at yahoo.co.uk>
>> >> >> >>>> To: volunga at yahoo.com
>> >> >> >>>> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions
>> >> >> >>>> <kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke>
>> >> >> >>>> Sent: Sat, April 3, 2010 12:03:22 PM
>> >> >> >>>> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Who is ICT Board? Hijacked
>> >> >> >>>>
>> >> >> >>>> Hi,
>> >> >> >>>> I rest my case on this issue, the ICT Board is a monolith,
>> >> >> >>>> Try reading this... (pdf file), as I feared it is mandated
>> >> >> >>>> to do anything and everything under the sun that could be
>> >> >> >>>> called ICT which includes your microwave oven and copier.
>> >> >> >>>> Functions of Kenya ICT Board The core functions of Kenya
>> >> >> >>>> ICT Board as documented in the Kenya
>> >> >> Gazette
>> >> >> >>>> Legal Notice No 26 of the May 2007:
>> >> >> >>>> ? To advice the government on all relevant matters
>> >> >> >>>> pertaining to development, coordination (remember the PM
>> >> >> >>>> post) and promotion of ICT industries in the country.
>> >> >> >>>> ? Promote both locally and internationally the
>> >> >> >>>> opportunities for investments in ICT technology ?
>> >> >> >>>> Facilitate and manage ICT industrial incubation parks and
>> >> >> technology
>> >> >> >>>> parks together with associated facilities on sites,
>> >> >> >>>> estates and
>> land.
>> >> >> >>>> ? Partner with agents within and without the country to
>> >> >> >>>> carry out
>> >> >> such
>> >> >> >>>> functions as it may consider necessary.
>> >> >> >>>> ? To transform and empower society through deployment and
>> >> >> >>>> use of
>> >> >> ICTs.
>> >> >> >>>> ? Carry out any other activity to promote and develop ICT
>> >> >> >>>> products
>> >> >> and
>> >> >> >>>> services.
>> >> >> >>>> Have a restful Easter as we await the limited range 4G,
>> >> >> >>>> yes you
>> >> >> guessed
>> >> >> >>>> it I
>> >> >> >>>> still have a 3G issue and I am in Nairobi.
>> >> >> >>>> Regards
>> >> >> >>>>
>> >> >> >>>>
>> >> >> >>>>
>> >> >> >>>>
>> >> >> >>>> _______________________________________________
>> >> >> >>>> kictanet mailing list
>> >> >> >>>> kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke
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>> >> >> >>>>
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>> >> >> rac
>> >> >> k%40gmail.com
>> >> >> >>>>
>> >> >> >>>>
>> >> >> >>>
>> >> >> >>>
>> >> >> >>>
>> >> >> >>> --
>> >> >> >>> Barrack O. Otieno
>> >> >> >>> Geneva
>> >> >> >>> Skype: barrack.otieno
>> >> >> >>>
>> >> >> >>> _______________________________________________
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>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > --
>> >> >> > Solomon Mb?r? Kamau
>> >> >> > P.O. Box 19343 - 00202 Nairobi
>> >> >> > Cell: (+254-0) 735 431041
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Man is a gregarious animal and enjoys agreement as cows will
>> >> >> > graze all the same way to the side of a hill!
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > AND
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > It is better to die in dignity than in the ignomity of
>> >> >> > ambiguous
>> >> >> generosity!
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > http://dawn-in-kenya.blogspot.com
>> >> >> > http://smiley2.wordpress.com http://mburu.sikika.co.ke
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > _______________________________________________
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>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> --
>> >> >> Barrack O. Otieno
>> >> >> Palais de Nations Genéve
>> >> >> Skype: barrack.otieno
>> >> >>
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