[Kictanet] RE: List Merger/amalgamation

Tue Sep 27 11:37:14 EAT 2005

Hi,

I believe the feeling by some members is that the KIP project and the
KICTANet process need to be clear on whether a merger of email lists
means a merger of processes & project plans.

- If the merge of e-mail discussion list does not mean a merger of two
projects/processes, then the answer is go-ahead. 

- If it means we merge processes, then let's first find out why KIP &
KICTANet should be one (other than avoiding the duplication of emails).
KICTANet has an evolving structure and plan of work. What is the KIP
project up to? If those two differ, then merger would not be prudent.

Is there anyone in a position to clarify the issues above?

>From the comments I have read on CS & MSPs, I believe Bill's point is
that private sector lobby groups (TESPOK, CSK, KIF et. al.) should not
be considered as 'civil society'.and that KICTANet is not 'civil
society' but rather, a 'multistakeholder forum' for CS, private sector
et. al. to develop common positions and partnerships for action. 

Regards
Wainaina

What is civil society meant to bring to the ICT policy and
implementation processes in Kenya? 
(Adapted from APC's (Karen Banks) CS presentation in Tokyo, May 2005)

Civil Society provides "a space between the market & the State". Neither
private sector nor government can play this role.

The role of civil society within KICTANet and other processes shall
include:

-	Accountability: keep political & market forces accountable to
the needs of all members of society

-	Transparency: encourage social responsibility and good
governance practice

-	People versus profit: advocate for development of social
projects & activities that are critical but may not be 'fashionable' or
profitable

-	Civil Society values: shaping vision of human-centred
information societies based on human rights, sustainable development,
social justice & empowerment

-----Original Message-----
From: bounce-kiplist-cl-117112 at lyris.idrc.ca
[mailto:bounce-kiplist-cl-117112 at lyris.idrc.ca] On Behalf Of Brian
Longwe
Sent: 27 September 2005 10:45
To: KIPlist
Cc: lelder at idrc.ca; lkirkham at idrc.or.ke
Subject: Re: List Merger/amalgamation

my suggestion is that the lists should be merged

Brian

On 27 Sep 2005, at 02:56, John Walubengo wrote:

> Unbelievably to the point.  These examples from Bill can never be  
> any better...I now know what Civil Society should really be  about...
>
> My only problem is that I am not sure whether we have resolved the  
> original issue:- Should we merge, cooperate or patner the two lists?
>
> Either way, I must confess that I am glad  that the issue has  
> raised more questions than answers...
>
> walu.
>
>
>>>> Bill Kagai <billkagai at gmail.com> 09/26/05 07:26PM >>>
>>>>
> On 9/26/05, waudo siganga <emailsignet at mailcan.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi Bill,
>>
>> I agree with you that "organizations representing or improving the
>> environment where private sector interests thrive cannot  
>> [necessarily]
>> be justified as Civil Society". However I do not agree with your
>> assertion that these organizations "do not care and neither would  
>> they
>> address the social implications of their direct
>> actions. " This is a very strong but wrong statement. The majority of
>> successful organizations in the private sector run well documented
>> social responsibilty programs, unless I have mis-understood you.
>>
>
> Hi Waudo,
>
> You got me wrong!! Let me use two or three examples to illustrate my
> point on social implications.
>
> 1. We know that internet exchange points have been established, fibre
> has been rolled around the metropolis, direct VSATs licensed...and
> realistically...though debatable, internet costs should go down. Has
> this happened?? No!! Because we cannot expect organisations fighting
> regulatory and licensing affairs to also fight the battle for
> consumers. Real Civil Society has to take up the issue of pushing for
> consumer protection in a multi-stakeholder environment to force a
> price reduction.
>
> 2. When a mobile telephone company at any one time holds kshs 9.00
> from each subscriber in their 3.1 million subscriber base..at any one
> time, that translates to kshs 27,900,000 at any one time. Whilst the
> mobile company might have good reasons for that, perhaps Civil Society
> can lobby that the interest accruing from that account is used to
> champion ICT or any other humanitarian rights equivalent to that
> amount. Telecommunication organisations might champion other interests
> but certainly not those that are in direct conflict with those of
> their members.
>
> These are just but two fallacies (by example) that only true Civil
> Society can champion...if the proper support goes to the right
> organisations. But again, they are hypothetical.
>
> [No persons are meant to be hurt in these examples and all characters
> are fictitious. Any resemblance to an entity that fits the description
> is purely by coincidence and any insinuation is highly regretted.]
>
> ---
> Submitted by: Bildad Kagia <billkagai at gmail.com> 2005-09-26  
> 12:31:37 EDT4
> (Please reply to original submitter for private communication)
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>
> ---
> Submitted by: John Walubengo <jwalubengo at kcct.ac.ke> 2005-09-27  
> 01:50:56 EDT4
> (Please reply to original submitter for private communication)
> ---
> You are currently subscribed to kiplist-cl as: [brian at pure-id.com]
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>

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Brian Longwe                           Tel: +254 20 316171
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KENYA                                       Putting the world in your  
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---
Submitted by: brian at inhand.co.ke 2005-09-27 02:46:48 EDT4
(Please reply to original submitter for private communication)
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