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<div style="direction:ltr">Oh I agree those may condemn homosexuality - but kenya is not limited to abrahamic religions and the constitution affords them no special privilege.</div>
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<div style="direction:ltr">I also point out that we cannot discount the religions of approximately 2.1 billion people on the planet that do not follow the abrahamic religions and choose other forms of faith - including Kenyans (and that’s not history - it’s
current day reality)</div>
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<div style="direction:ltr">Andrew</div>
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<div id="divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><font face="Calibri, sans-serif" color="#000000" style="font-size:11pt"><b>From:</b> Twahir Hussein Kassim <twahir@hussein.me.ke><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, April 30, 2018 7:55:45 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Andrew Alston<br>
<b>Cc:</b> KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [kictanet] Banning of the FILM Rafiki</font>
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<div>Andrew,
<div dir="auto"><br>
</div>
<div dir="auto">Thanks for the history class. By religion I meant the Abrahamic religions; namely Judaism, Christianity and Islam.</div>
<div dir="auto"><br>
</div>
<div dir="auto">I am yet to see any text from the above mentioned condoning homosexuality.</div>
<div dir="auto"><br>
</div>
<div dir="auto">Twahir</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Apr 30, 2018 16:17, "Andrew Alston" <<a href="mailto:Andrew.Alston@liquidtelecom.com">Andrew.Alston@liquidtelecom.com</a>> wrote:<br type="attribution">
<blockquote class="quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex; border-left:1px #ccc solid; padding-left:1ex">
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<div class="m_-4070610943313062969WordSection1">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>Actually – there are many religions that have no issue with homosexuality.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>Buddhism makes no distinction between hetrosexual or homosexual relations<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>The wiccan religion has a text that says “all acts of love and pleasure are my rituals”<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>Hinduism makes no distinction (and in 2009 the Hindu Council UK explicity stated this)<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>The Vedas religious texts even go so far as to refer to people in a third gender that is neither male nor female.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>In Sikhism marriage is seen as a union of souls, and the soul is seen as genderless.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>The list goes on and on and on – so sorry – your stance that no religion supports LGBT relationships as ok – is factually incorrect.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>Andrew<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US"> kictanet [mailto:<a href="mailto:kictanet-bounces%2Bandrew.alston" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">kictanet-bounces+andrew.alston</a>=<a href="mailto:liquidtelecom.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">liquidtelecom.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Twahir Hussein Kassim via kictanet<br>
<b>Sent:</b> 30 April 2018 15:55<br>
<b>To:</b> Andrew Alston <<a href="mailto:Andrew.Alston@liquidtelecom.com" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">Andrew.Alston@liquidtelecom.com</a>><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Twahir Hussein Kassim <<a href="mailto:twahir@hussein.me.ke" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">twahir@hussein.me.ke</a>></span></p>
<div class="elided-text"><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [kictanet] Banning of the FILM Rafiki<u></u><u></u></div>
<p></p>
<div class="elided-text">
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Reading from the preamble to the constitution, I would like to give my
<b><span style="color:#4caf50">thoughts</span></b> below within the text of the constitution copied from a previous email<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">CONSTITUTION OF KENYA</span></b><span style="font-size:9.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<div>
<p><span style="font-size:10.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">PREAMBLE<br>
<b>ACKNOWLEDGING </b>the supremacy of the Almighty God of all creation:</span><span style="font-size:9.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p><b><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif; color:#4caf50">My belief is that this is a declaration within the constitution that the supremacy of The Almighty is ABOVE ALL. I doubt if there is any religion that accepts LGBT relationships to be fine. Going
back to the scripts we will NOTE a whole nation being destroyed due to this very act. Whether Kenya has a state religion or not GAY relations shouldn't be ok. </span></b><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p><b><span style="font-size:10.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">HONOURING </span></b><span style="font-size:10.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">those who heroically struggled to bring freedom and justice to our land:</span><span style="font-size:9.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p><b><span style="font-size:10.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">PROUD </span></b><span style="font-size:10.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">of our ethnic, cultural and religious diversity, and determined to live in peace and unity as one indivisible
sovereign nation:</span><span style="font-size:9.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p><b><span style="font-size:18.0pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif; color:#4caf50">Proud of ethnic diversity, none of our diverse culture agree with this act. Am not refuting that it has been practised for donkey years; however NEVER has it been FORCED DOWN
our throats to accept it as a norm. We did interact with gays before but they were not openly blatantly plying their trade. This only started when the west started pushing.</span></b><span style="font-size:9.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p><b><span style="font-size:18.0pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif; color:#4caf50">There is a LINE we as a people MUST DRAW! Come on guys!</span></b><span style="font-size:9.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p><b><span style="font-size:10.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">RESPECTFUL </span></b><span style="font-size:10.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">of the environment, which is our heritage, and determined to sustain it for the benefit of future generations:</span><span style="font-size:9.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p><b><span style="font-size:10.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">COMMITTED </span></b><span style="font-size:10.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">to nurturing and protecting the well-being of the individual, the family, communities and the nation:</span><span style="font-size:9.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p><b><span style="font-size:10.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">RECOGNISING </span></b><span style="font-size:10.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">the aspirations of all Kenyans for a government based on the essential values of human rights, equality,
freedom, democracy, social justice and the rule of law:</span><span style="font-size:9.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p><b><span style="font-size:18.0pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif; color:#4caf50"> If we play the HUMAN RIGHT card, then why arrest a consenting adult who chooses to commit suicide? Isn't it his right to live?</span></b><span style="font-size:9.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p><b><span style="font-size:18.0pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif; color:#4caf50">Freedom comes with responsibility and most of all we OWE it to the generations to come to maintain a MORAL FABRIC that reflects us as a people! LGBT doesn't stand the test of
morality if it goes against the very supreme being that we claim to acknowledge!</span></b><span style="font-size:9.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p><b><span style="font-size:10.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">EXERCISING </span></b><span style="font-size:10.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">our sovereign and inalienable right to determine the form of governance of our country and having participated
fully in the making of this Constitution:</span><span style="font-size:9.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p><b><span style="font-size:10.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">ADOPT, ENACT </span></b><span style="font-size:10.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">and give this Constitution to ourselves and to our future generations.</span><span style="font-size:9.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:10.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">GOD BLESS KENYA </span><span style="font-size:9.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p><b><span style="font-size:18.0pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif; color:#4caf50">These are my opinions, I don't mean to disrespect anyone. </span></b><span style="font-size:9.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p><b><span style="font-size:18.0pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif; color:#4caf50">Twahir</span></b><span style="font-size:9.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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</div>
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<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On Apr 30, 2018 15:26, "Lawrence Dinga, CISSP via kictanet" <<a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
<blockquote style="border:none; border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt; padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt; margin-left:4.8pt; margin-right:0cm">
<p class="MsoNormal">@Alex<br>
<br>
I am open to any introduction and as I said the issue of morality is <br>
subjective and conscience based. You may see gay relationship as okay and <br>
right from your perspective. However, to another person, it may be immoral <br>
depending on one's beliefs.<br>
<br>
The board has also given the reasons behind the ban.<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
<br>
Regards<br>
<br>
<br>
-----Original Message----- <br>
From: Alex Comninos<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Sent: Monday, April 30, 2018 3:09 PM<br>
To: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<br>
Cc: <a href="mailto:ldinga@managecom.co.ke" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">ldinga@managecom.co.ke</a><br>
Subject: Re: [kictanet] Banning of the FILM Rafiki<br>
<br>
@Lawrence<br>
<br>
Why is love between two consenting non-abusive people a morality issue?<br>
<br>
Please explain?<br>
<br>
There are many issues of morality in relationships, but what does the<br>
sexual orientation of the partners have to do with anything?<br>
<br>
So basically you are saying being gay is immoral, it would be nice if you<br>
could back that up without resorting to the first testament.<br>
<br>
Once again, I am more than willing to introduce you to my LGBT friends and<br>
their morality. If you would like to be introduced and learn something,<br>
contact me.<br>
<br>
Kindly,<br>
Alex<br>
On Mon, 30 Apr 2018 at 14:05, Lawrence Dinga, CISSP via kictanet <<br>
<a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>> wrote:<br>
<br>
> Religion a side I think this is an issue of morality but I agree,<br>
morality can be subjective and depends on one’s conscience.<br>
<br>
> Regards<br>
<br>
> From: Mwendwa Kivuva via kictanet<br>
> Sent: Monday, April 30, 2018 2:50 PM<br>
> To: <a href="mailto:ldinga@managecom.co.ke" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">ldinga@managecom.co.ke</a><br>
> Cc: Mwendwa Kivuva<br>
> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Banning of the FILM Rafiki<br>
<br>
> KFCB always makes roadside pronouncements that would not pass any legal<br>
threshold.<br>
<br>
> And quoting the Bible here is imposing your religion on others who<br>
believe in different deities.<br>
<br>
> Ebele, No, there is no State religion in Kenya, and our constitution<br>
recognises freedom of worship.<br>
<br>
> Article 32 of Kenyan Constitution:<br>
<br>
> 32. FREEDOM OF CONSCIENCE, RELIGION, BELIEF AND OPINION<br>
<br>
> (1) Every person has the right to freedom of conscience, religion,<br>
thought, belief and opinion.<br>
<br>
> (2) Every person has the right, either individually or in community with<br>
others, in public or in private, to manifest any religion or belief through<br>
worship, practice, teaching or observance, including observance of a day of<br>
worship.<br>
<br>
> (3) A person may not be denied access to any institution, employment or<br>
facility, or the enjoyment of any right, because of the person's belief or<br>
religion.<br>
<br>
> (4) A person shall not be compelled to act, or engage in any act, that is<br>
contrary to the person's belief or religion.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
> On Mon, Apr 30, 2018, 2:36 PM Ebele Okobi via kictanet <<br>
<a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>> wrote:<br>
<br>
>> Does Kenya have a state religion?<br>
<br>
>> On 4/30/18, 12:33 PM, "kictanet on behalf of Lawrence Dinga, CISSP via<br>
kictanet" <kictanet-bounces+ebeleokobi=<a href="mailto:fb.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">fb.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a> on<br>
behalf of <a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">
kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>> wrote:<br>
<br>
>> Dear Alex,<br>
<br>
>> I don’t know much about the movie but if it is about lesbianism then<br>
it is<br>
>> immoral and ungodly.<br>
>> God only approves a relation between a man and a woman<br>
<br>
>> Leviticus 18:22<br>
>> You shall not lie with a male as with a woman; it is an abomination.<br>
<br>
>> Genesis 2:24<br>
>> Therefore a man shall leave his father and his mother and hold fast<br>
to his<br>
>> wife, and they shall become one flesh.<br>
<br>
>> Regards<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
>> -----Original Message-----<br>
>> From: Alex Comninos via kictanet<br>
>> Sent: Monday, April 30, 2018 2:05 PM<br>
>> To: <a href="mailto:ldinga@managecom.co.ke" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">
ldinga@managecom.co.ke</a><br>
>> Cc: Alex Comninos ; KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<br>
>> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Banning of the FILM Rafiki<br>
<br>
>> I am not sure what the film is about in its entirety, but the main<br>
>> storyline is a lesbian romance in Nairobi. It is the first Kenyan<br>
film to<br>
>> be nominated for the Cannes film festival and will premiere there on<br>
the<br>
>> 8th of May.<br>
<br>
>> Here is the trailer for the film<br>
<a rel="noreferrer" href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7M_-ucSaFpU" target="_blank">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7M_-ucSaFpU</a><br>
<br>
<br>
>> On Mon, 30 Apr 2018 at 12:57, Dorcas Muthoni <<a href="mailto:dmuthoni@gmail.com" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">dmuthoni@gmail.com</a>><br>
wrote:<br>
<br>
>> > What is the film about?<br>
<br>
>> > On Mon, Apr 30, 2018, 1:55 PM Alex Comninos via kictanet <<br>
>> <a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">
kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>> wrote:<br>
<br>
>> >> Hi<br>
<br>
>> >> I was shocked to learn that the film classification board has<br>
banned an<br>
>> >> LGBT film, Rafiki.<br>
<br>
>> >> Our Film and Publication Board recently attempted this but it was<br>
>> reversed<br>
>> >> by the courts.<br>
<br>
>> >> Films are ICTs and we should be discussing this on the list.<br>
<br>
>> >> I am looking forward to the discussion.<br>
<br>
>> >> Kind regards,<br>
>> >> Alex<br>
<br>
>> >> _______________________________________________<br>
>> >> kictanet mailing list<br>
>> >> <a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">
kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a><br>
>> >><br>
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<br>
>> >> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder<br>
platform<br>
>> for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy <br>
>> and<br>
>> regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the<br>
ICT<br>
>> sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and<br>
development.<br>
<br>
>> >> KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable<br>
behaviors<br>
>> online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and<br>
bandwidth,<br>
>> share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect<br>
privacy, do<br>
>> not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
>> --<br>
>> ...<br>
>> Alex Comninos<br>
<br>
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>> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder<br>
platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy<br>
and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT<br>
sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.<br>
<br>
>> KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable<br>
behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and<br>
bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect<br>
privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.<br>
<br>
<br>
>> _______________________________________________<br>
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<br>
>> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform<br>
for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and<br>
regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT<br>
sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.<br>
<br>
>> KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors<br>
online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth,<br>
share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do<br>
not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.<br>
<br>
> ________________________________<br>
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<br>
> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform<br>
for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and<br>
regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT<br>
sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.<br>
<br>
> KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors<br>
online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth,<br>
share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do<br>
not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.<br>
<br>
> _______________________________________________<br>
> kictanet mailing list<br>
> <a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">
kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a><br>
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<br>
> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform<br>
for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and<br>
regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT<br>
sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.<br>
<br>
> KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors<br>
online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth,<br>
share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do<br>
not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
-- <br>
...<br>
Alex Comninos<br>
<a rel="noreferrer" href="http://comninos.org" target="_blank">http://comninos.org</a>
<br>
<br>
<br>
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<br>
The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT
enabled growth and development.<br>
<br>
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or
qualifications.<u></u><u></u></p>
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