<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body dir="auto">Mwendwa<div><br></div><div>So I’m curious why the blanket rejection by LSK?<br><br><div id="AppleMailSignature"><div><span style="-webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(26, 26, 26, 0.294118); -webkit-composition-fill-color: rgba(175, 192, 227, 0.231373);"><b>Ali Hussein</b></span></div><div><span style="-webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(26, 26, 26, 0.294118); -webkit-composition-fill-color: rgba(175, 192, 227, 0.231373);"><b>Principal</b></span></div><div><b style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);">Hussein & Associates</b></div><div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: medium; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(26, 26, 26, 0.296875); -webkit-composition-fill-color: rgba(175, 192, 227, 0.230469); -webkit-composition-frame-color: rgba(77, 128, 180, 0.230469); -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; ">+254 0713 601113 </div><div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: medium; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(26, 26, 26, 0.296875); -webkit-composition-fill-color: rgba(175, 192, 227, 0.230469); -webkit-composition-frame-color: rgba(77, 128, 180, 0.230469); -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; "><br></div><div><p style="margin: 0in 0in 0pt;"><span style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);">Twitter: @AliHKassim</span></p><span style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);"><font></font></span><p style="margin: 0in 0in 0pt;"><span style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);">Skype: abu-jomo</span></p><p style="margin: 0in 0in 0pt;"><span style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);">LinkedIn: <a href="http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim" target="_blank">http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim</a></span></p><font><br></font></div><div><span style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);">"We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, therefore, is not an act but a habit." ~ Aristotle</span></div><div><br></div><div><span style="-webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(26, 26, 26, 0.294118); -webkit-composition-fill-color: rgba(175, 192, 227, 0.231373);"><br></span></div>Sent from my iPad</div><div><br>On 13 Apr 2018, at 12:10 AM, Mwendwa Kivuva via kictanet <<a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><div><span></span></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><div dir="auto">Ali, actually, the lawyers were not disrupted, or were they?<div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Conveyancing and sell contracts will still remain as before. Maybe I'm wrong.</div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr">On Thu, Apr 12, 2018, 10:20 PM Barrack Otieno via kictanet <<a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Hi Ali and learned colleagues,<br>
<br>
You know any public participation initiative on land related issues<br>
would end up like Bomas 1 when we were doing the new constitution.<br>
That said , there was and still is need for public participation, i<br>
hope the new CS Farida Karoney can breath fresh air at the Registry.<br>
Thank you Walu for the article.<br>
<br>
<br>
Regards<br>
<br>
On 4/12/18, Admin CampusCiti via kictanet <<a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>> wrote:<br>
> @Kanini and @Victor,<br>
><br>
> The lawyers bold enough to come out fighting. @Rosemary, we are watching<br>
> you. We won’t allow you to all of a sudden become a lurker 😆<br>
><br>
> To your point Kanini - one of the biggest determinants of success or failure<br>
> of any Digital Transformation initiative is not the technology itself but<br>
> CULTURE. I fear this initiative is doomed to fail simply because it hasn’t<br>
> carried stakeholders along.<br>
><br>
> I fear a lot of government initiatives will go this way if CULTURE is not<br>
> changed.<br>
><br>
> Ali Hussein<br>
> Hussein & Associates<br>
> +254 0713 601113<br>
><br>
> Twitter: @AliHKassim<br>
> Skype: abu-jomo<br>
> LinkedIn: <a href="http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim</a><br>
> Blog: <a href="http://www.alyhussein.com" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">www.alyhussein.com</a><br>
><br>
> "Discovery consists in seeing what everyone else has seen and thinking what<br>
> no one else has thought". ~ Albert Szent-Györgyi<br>
><br>
> Sent from my iPad<br>
><br>
>> On 12 Apr 2018, at 9:45 PM, kanini mutemi via kictanet<br>
>> <<a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>> wrote:<br>
>><br>
>> We are here @Ali. Some of us don’t agree with LSK’s position. Yes public<br>
>> participation wasn’t carried out and that was the original sin. However,<br>
>> we should be fighting for a pause to consider public comment not bluntly<br>
>> asking to go back to the analogue system. We can’t be seen to be fighting<br>
>> digitization. But you understand why lawyers aren’t excited about some<br>
>> digital developments eg smart lawyer platforms 😛<br>
>><br>
>> That being said, it must be understood that this digitization doesn’t<br>
>> solve the inherent problems in conveyancing. Eg applying for a search,<br>
>> whether physically or online, doesn’t guarantee you that there isn’t a<br>
>> copycat file in the lands registry that could return misleading results.<br>
>> Again, we have said on this list before that technology is not a magic<br>
>> wand. Our land dishonesty problem won’t disappear because we’ve reduced<br>
>> the foot traffic at Ardhi House. Also, picking up lessons from e-citizen,<br>
>> company registration is online yes but you still need an ‘insider’ to help<br>
>> you use the platform sometimes because applications may take time or the<br>
>> platform returns error messages you wouldn’t be able to interpret on your<br>
>> own.<br>
>><br>
>> Ps: The previous administration peddled digitisation of the lands registry<br>
>> too. Registries were closed severally to that effect. Perhaps there’s a<br>
>> procurement question here. Was that mere scanning of records? Who did it?<br>
>> Who is providing the services for the current process? How were they<br>
>> engaged?<br>
>><br>
>>> On Thu, 12 Apr 2018 at 21:30, Victor Kapiyo via kictanet<br>
>>> <<a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>> wrote:<br>
>>> The lawyers are here. We have been otherwise occupied trying to figure<br>
>>> out how the new LMIS system works, in order to facilitate your<br>
>>> conveyancing transactions!<br>
>>><br>
>>> I wonder why some people want to digitise wakili's out of business,<br>
>>> surely. Jameni? Can't we be left to 'eat' our legal fees in peace?<br>
>>><br>
>>> Anyway, I think this is a good initiative. Trust me all lawyers want<br>
>>> these land transactions to move quicker. Only that we need, for the<br>
>>> benefits of our clients, to ensure there is proper due diligence done to<br>
>>> ensure the integrity of land transactions. As you're all probably aware,<br>
>>> land disputes form a huge chunk of cases in our courts - in fact there is<br>
>>> an entire court (ELC) dedicated to land matters. We facilitate the<br>
>>> conveyance process and do not as some suggest, act as obstacles to land<br>
>>> transactions. In fact, the faster we transact, the sooner we get paid -<br>
>>> so nobody wants delays. Delays are caused by inefficiency, corruption,<br>
>>> bureacracy and disorganisation in some of the registries. It is also<br>
>>> important to note that the property management framework is a very<br>
>>> complex regime and whereas technology can enhance such processes, there<br>
>>> are certain technicalities that require a legal mind to determine.<br>
>>><br>
>>> That said, the challenge with this government project is that it was<br>
>>> conceptualised, designed and implemented - i believe in secret - and<br>
>>> without adequate participation of key stakeholders. How many people here<br>
>>> knew of the details of the land registry digitisation process until the<br>
>>> lands registry in Nairobi was closed to the public for the migration<br>
>>> process last month? If the process was more participatory, and there was<br>
>>> better communication and awareness, then i doubt we would be having the<br>
>>> issues being raised here or in the articles. As lawyers, we want change.<br>
>>> But the technocrats developing ICT systems for e-government need to be<br>
>>> more transparent about such projects. As we speak there is no programme<br>
>>> for training on using the system or a manual at best - save for a sketchy<br>
>>> 1 min. 29 sec. video and a paragraph with scanty instructions (see<br>
>>> screenshot). Jameni. We must strive to implement such projects better, if<br>
>>> the country has to get to where it needs to. The approaches to e-gov<br>
>>> programmes need to be more holistic, strategic and systematic to ensure<br>
>>> success. We deserve better, and we can do better.<br>
>>><br>
>>> Ni hayo tu.<br>
>>><br>
>>> Victor Kapiyo<br>
>>> Partner | Lawmark Partners LLP<br>
>>> Advocate of the High Court of Kenya, Commissioner for Oaths & Notary<br>
>>> Public<br>
>>> Suite No. 8, Centro House, Westlands, Nairobi | Web: <a href="http://www.lawmark.co.ke" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">www.lawmark.co.ke</a><br>
>>> ====================================================<br>
>>> “Your attitude, not your aptitude, will determine your altitude” Zig<br>
>>> Ziglar<br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>>> On 12 April 2018 at 18:05, Ali Hussein via kictanet<br>
>>>> <<a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>> wrote:<br>
>>><br>
>>>> Where are the lawyers?<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> Ukiwa upande huu utajitetee...Ukiwa upande ule... LOL<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> Ali Hussein<br>
>>>> Principal<br>
>>>> AHK & Associates<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> Tel: +254 713 601113<br>
>>>> Twitter: @AliHKassim<br>
>>>> Skype: abu-jomo<br>
>>>> LinkedIn: <a href="http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim</a><br>
>>>><br>
>>>> 13th Floor , Delta Towers, Oracle Wing,<br>
>>>> Chiromo Road, Westlands,<br>
>>>> Nairobi, Kenya.<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> Any information of a personal nature expressed in this email are purely<br>
>>>> mine and do not necessarily reflect the official positions of the<br>
>>>> organizations that I work with.<br>
>>>><br>
>>>>> On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 5:57 PM, Walubengo J via kictanet<br>
>>>>> <<a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>> wrote:<br>
>>>>> @SMM,<br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>> I am under 'Siekke' for the article ;-)<br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>> I received a message from one of the lawyers who promised me a 'Class<br>
>>>>> Suit'. Am googling what that means and hope the digital lawyers onlist<br>
>>>>> will come to my aid ;-)<br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>> walu.<br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>> On Thursday, April 12, 2018, 4:30:44 PM GMT+3, S.M. Muraya via kictanet<br>
>>>>> <<a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>> wrote:<br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>> Correction: Article is via @JWalu<br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>> <a href="https://www.nation.co.ke/oped/" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.nation.co.ke/oped/</a> blogs/dot9/walubengo/2274560-<br>
>>>>> 4380642-lfxopw/index.html<br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>> The discussion the Lands ministry should have been having with the<br>
>>>>> lawyers is about how to amend the law to enable end-to-end land<br>
>>>>> transactions rather than how to protect the lawyers from the inevitable<br>
>>>>> disruption that technology is bringing.<br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>> LSK argument for remaining analogue, being anti digital..<br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>> <a href="https://www.businessdailyafrica.com/news/Ministry-switch-to-online-land-registry-sparks-row-with-LSK/539546-4376104-i3oh05/index.html" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.businessdailyafrica.com/news/Ministry-switch-to-online-land-registry-sparks-row-with-LSK/539546-4376104-i3oh05/index.html</a><br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>> LSK cites section 34 of the Advocates Act which states: “No unqualified<br>
>>>>> person shall, either directly or indirectly, take instructions, draw or<br>
>>>>> prepare any document or instrument relating to the conveyancing of<br>
>>>>> property.”<br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>> <a href="https://www" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www</a>. <a href="http://businessdailyafrica.com/news/" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">businessdailyafrica.com/news/</a> Ministry-switch-to-online-<br>
>>>>> land-registry-sparks-row-with- LSK/539546-4376104-i3oh05/ index.html<br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>> On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 3:55 PM, S.M. Muraya <<a href="mailto:murigi.muraya@gmail.com" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">murigi.muraya@gmail.com</a>><br>
>>>>> wrote:<br>
>>>>> Noted well @walu<br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>> The discussion the Lands ministry should have been having with the<br>
>>>>> lawyers is about how to amend the law to enable end-to-end land<br>
>>>>> transactions rather than how to protect the lawyers from the inevitable<br>
>>>>> disruption that technology is bringing.<br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>> <a href="https://www.nation.co.ke/oped/" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.nation.co.ke/oped/</a> blogs/dot9/walubengo/2274560-<br>
>>>>> 4380642-lfxopw/index.html<br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>> --<br>
>>>>> SMM<br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>> "Better a patient person than a warrior, one with self-control than one<br>
>>>>> who takes a city." Prov 16:32<br>
>>>>> _______________________________________________<br>
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>>>>><br>
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>>>>><br>
>>>>> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform<br>
>>>>> for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and<br>
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>>>>> sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and<br>
>>>>> development.<br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>> KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors<br>
>>>>> online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and<br>
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>>>><br>
>>>><br>
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>>><br>
>>>><br>
>>>><br>
>>>> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform<br>
>>>> for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and<br>
>>>> regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT<br>
>>>> sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and<br>
>>>> development.<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors<br>
>>>> online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and<br>
>>>> bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect<br>
>>>> privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.<br>
>>>><br>
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>>><br>
>>> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform<br>
>>> for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and<br>
>>> regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT<br>
>>> sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and<br>
>>> development.<br>
>>><br>
>>> KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors<br>
>>> online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and<br>
>>> bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect<br>
>>> privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.<br>
>> --<br>
>> Mercy Mutemi, Advocate.<br>
>><br>
>><br>
>><br>
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>><br>
>> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform<br>
>> for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and<br>
>> regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT<br>
>> sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and<br>
>> development.<br>
>><br>
>> KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors<br>
>> online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth,<br>
>> share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do<br>
>> not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.<br>
><br>
<br>
<br>
-- <br>
Barrack O. Otieno<br>
+254721325277<br>
+254733206359<br>
Skype: barrack.otieno<br>
PGP ID: 0x2611D86A<br>
<br>
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.<br>
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</div></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><div><span>_______________________________________________</span><br><span>kictanet mailing list</span><br><span><a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a></span><br><span><a href="https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet">https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet</a></span><br><span>Twitter: <a href="http://twitter.com/kictanet">http://twitter.com/kictanet</a></span><br><span>Facebook: <a href="https://www.facebook.com/KICTANet/">https://www.facebook.com/KICTANet/</a></span><br><span>Domain Registration sponsored by <a href="http://www.eacdirectory.co.ke">www.eacdirectory.co.ke</a></span><br><span></span><br><span>Unsubscribe or change your options at <a href="https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/info%40alyhussein.com">https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/info%40alyhussein.com</a></span><br><span></span><br><span>The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.</span><br><span></span><br><span>KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.</span><br></div></blockquote></div></body></html>