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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Christian,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>100% agreed. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Regards <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> kictanet [mailto:kictanet-bounces+bkioko=bernsoft.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke] <b>On Behalf Of </b>christian kisutsa via kictanet<br><b>Sent:</b> Thursday, January 29, 2015 6:37 PM<br><b>To:</b> bkioko@bernsoft.com<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [kictanet] Music Copyright Owners sue ISPs for allowing Kenyans to download content illegally<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>Hi all,<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Unfortunately,most of the population here in Kenya,do not have a culture of buying music. . .we prefer freebies. . .A vast majority would download the video from youtube and convert to mp3. If that's not the case,how usually brrow a whole folder of Kenyan music from a friend? . . .Such steps are good to ensure artists get their dues,but when you don't factor in the the buyers purchase psychology then not much will be achieved. . .I believe they should embrace a data driven approach,they should study why most kenyans simply don't like buying music, address those concerns that they find and then create incentives. . .the next logical step would be to work with key stakeholders in the music industry and then move forward from there with the supporting legislation and proper enforcement.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Regards,<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Christian <o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>On Thu, Jan 29, 2015 at 6:24 PM, Mark Mwangi via kictanet <<a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>As a creator of original works is good that you are taking steps to protecting it and the allied benefeciaries of the same. I agree with @cdohnio on a need to rethink the business model because it is more of a hurdle than an incentive. I once tried to look for Hardstone's Uhiki and I could only find it on some Russian server. Nothing stored locally. I will admit this was before M-Pesa and a regular income so paying for it was hardly an option. <o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>But do people pirate because they don't want to pay or is it because they find it a bother to use the sanctioned means? Say I want to buy a track from Elani. What are the DRM and payment issues that I will need to have it on my phone, laptop and car stereo?<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>On Thu, Jan 29, 2015 at 5:47 PM, Bernard Kioko via kictanet <<a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in'><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Mwendwa,</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>In one case the host servers are in Turkey…..any insight on that?</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Regards</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> kictanet [mailto:<a href="mailto:kictanet-bounces%2Bbkioko" target="_blank">kictanet-bounces+bkioko</a>=<a href="mailto:bernsoft.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank">bernsoft.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Mwendwa Kivuva via kictanet<br><b>Sent:</b> Thursday, January 29, 2015 3:30 PM<br><b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:bkioko@bernsoft.com" target="_blank">bkioko@bernsoft.com</a><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [kictanet] Music Copyright Owners sue ISPs for allowing Kenyans to download content illegally</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>We have no "precedence" in Kenya on any intermediary liability case. It's a good move for the copyright owners to have this case brought forward and see what direction as a country we should take. This might spur players in the industry to bring legislation to parliament on the same.<o:p></o:p></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>What has worked very effectively elsewhere was The Digital Millennium Copyright Act (DMCA), a United States copyright law that implements two 1996 treaties of the World Intellectual Property Organization (WIPO). This essentially entails copyright owners policing online content and issuing takedown notices.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>When you Google content that has takedown notices, you get this response:<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><div style='margin-top:12.0pt;margin-bottom:12.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><i><span style='font-size:13.5pt'>In response to a complaint we received under the <a href="https://www.google.com/support/bin/answer.py?answer=1386831" target="_blank"><span style='color:#660099;text-decoration:none'>US Digital Millennium Copyright Act</span></a>, we have removed 1 result(s) from this page. If you wish, you may <a href="http://www.chillingeffects.org/notice.cgi?sID=10204135" target="_blank"><span style='color:#660099;text-decoration:none'>read the DMCA complaint</span></a> that caused the removal(s) atChillingEffects.org.</span></i><o:p></o:p></p></div><div style='margin-top:12.0pt;margin-bottom:12.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><i><span style='font-size:13.5pt'>In response to a complaint we received under the <a href="https://www.google.com/support/bin/answer.py?answer=1386831" target="_blank"><span style='color:#660099;text-decoration:none'>US Digital Millennium Copyright Act</span></a>, we have removed 1 result(s) from this page. If you wish, you may <a href="http://www.chillingeffects.org/notice.cgi?sID=10246859" target="_blank"><span style='color:#660099;text-decoration:none'>read the DMCA complaint</span></a> that caused the removal(s) atChillingEffects.org.</span></i><o:p></o:p></p></div><div style='margin-top:12.0pt;margin-bottom:12.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><i><span style='font-size:13.5pt'>In response to a complaint we received under the <a href="https://www.google.com/support/bin/answer.py?answer=1386831" target="_blank"><span style='color:#660099;text-decoration:none'>US Digital Millennium Copyright Act</span></a>, we have removed 1 result(s) from this page. If you wish, you may <a href="http://www.chillingeffects.org/notice.cgi?sID=10261005" target="_blank"><span style='color:#660099;text-decoration:none'>read the DMCA complaint</span></a> that caused the removal(s) atChillingEffects.org.</span></i><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><br clear=all><o:p></o:p></p><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>______________________<br>Mwendwa Kivuva, Nairobi, Kenya<br><br>"There are some men who lift the age they inhabit, till all men walk on higher ground in that lifetime." - Maxwell Anderson<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>On 29 January 2015 at 14:57, Mark Kipyegon via kictanet <<a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>From a technical standpoint how feasible is it to simply blacklist sites?<br><br>Clone sites and proxies exist to circumvent these blocks.<br><br><br>On 29/01/2015 14:48, Bernard Kioko via kictanet wrote:<br>> James i posted a link where high court in UK ruled those same sites be<br>> blocked by ISPs and that's happening.<br>><br>> What's ur comment on that?<br>> On Jan 29, 2015 2:43 PM, "James Mbugua via kictanet" <<br>> <a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>> wrote:<br>><br>>> Listers,<br>>><br>>> Hmm...I don't know why I get the feeling this is a case of throwing mud at<br>>> the wall to see if it will stick.<br>>><br>>> ISPs have never been held liable for downloading illegal content anywhere<br>>> in the world. From the get go let us dispense with that. Neither will they<br>>> be found so in this case.<br>>><br>>> I remember vividly when Napster came out and also when Kazaa<br>>> followed....groups went after the sites not the ISPs. To this day, it is<br>>> piracy sites that even the FBI goes for not the likes of Comcast or AT$T.<br>>> Data privacy does not allow you to start checking what your customer is<br>>> downloading or uploading....this is not China and getting into that<br>>> territory is very dangerous for people's rights.<br>>><br>>> Let these guys do the hard work and go for the piracy sites or sue NTSA<br>>> for allowing bhang to be transported on our roads.<br>>><br>>> lol<br>>><br>>> Regards,<br>>><br>>> James<br>>><br>>><br>>><o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'>>> On Thu, Jan 29, 2015 at 2:30 PM, Davis Onsakia via kictanet <<br>>> <a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>> wrote:<br>>><br>>>> Will be an interesting case to keep the eye on.<br>>>><br>>>> What is not in doubt is that the final ruling will set a very serious<br>>>> precedent on how to deal with copyright issues when it comes to the Online<br>>>> World.<br>>>><br>>>> Best Regards,<br>>>> Davis M Onsakia<br>>>> "One doesn't discover new lands without consenting to lose sight of the<br>>>> shore for a very long time."<br>>>><br>>>> On 29 January 2015 at 13:46, Bernard Kioko via kictanet <<br>>>> <a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>> wrote:<br>>>><br>>>>> Reading from the article it says there is a list.<br>>>>> On Jan 29, 2015 1:23 PM, "Dennis Kioko" <<a href="mailto:dmbuvi@gmail.com" target="_blank">dmbuvi@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>>>>><br>>>>>> Does Kenya have necessary laws, and do the copyright holders have a<br>>>>>> list of infringing sites?<br>>>>>><br>>>>>> On Thu, 29 Jan 2015 13:04 Bernard Kioko <<a href="mailto:bkioko@bernsoft.com" target="_blank">bkioko@bernsoft.com</a>> wrote:<br>>>>>><br>>>>>>><br>>>>>>> <a href="http://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.php/2014/11/uk-high-court-forces-big-isps-block-56-new-internet-piracy-websites.html" target="_blank">http://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.php/2014/11/uk-high-court-forces-big-isps-block-56-new-internet-piracy-websites.html</a><br>>>>>>> On Jan 29, 2015 12:51 PM, "Dennis Kioko via kictanet" <<br>>>>>>> <a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>> wrote:<br>>>>>>><br>>>>>>>> Interesting case, though I wonder how ISPs allow people to allow<br>>>>>>>> content illegally. Any one with some insight?<br>>>>>>>> <a href="http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Corporate-News/Music-copyright-owners-illegal-downloads/-/539550/2605386/-/na4mbsz/-/index.html" target="_blank">http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Corporate-News/Music-copyright-owners-illegal-downloads/-/539550/2605386/-/na4mbsz/-/index.html</a><br>>>>>>>><br>>>>>>>><br><br>_______________________________________________<br>kictanet mailing list<br><a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a><br><a href="https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet" target="_blank">https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet</a><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Unsubscribe or change your options at <a href="https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/kivuva%40transworldafrica.com" target="_blank">https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/kivuva%40transworldafrica.com</a><o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><br>The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.<br><br>KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.<o:p></o:p></p></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div><div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><strong><hr size=2 width="100%" align=center></strong></div><p style='line-height:115%'><img border=0 id="_x0000_i1026" src="http://bernsoft.com/img/logo.jpg"><span style='font-size:9.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Georgia","serif";background:white'><br><br>This e-mail and any attachments may contain information that is confidential, legally privileged and protected by law and is intended for the sole use of the named recipient(s). 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For further information about us, please contact us at the address indicated below.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p style='line-height:115%'><span style='font-size:9.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Georgia","serif";background:white'><br>Bernsoft Interactive Limited - P O Box 15177-00100 Nairobi - Tel: <a href="tel:%2B254%20722%20929192" target="_blank">+254 722 929192</a> Email: <a href="mailto:admin@bernsoft.com" target="_blank">admin@bernsoft.com</a> Web: <a href="http://www.bernsoft.com" target="_blank">www.bernsoft.com</a> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><br>_______________________________________________<br>kictanet mailing list<br><a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a><br><a href="https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet" target="_blank">https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet</a><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal>Unsubscribe or change your options at <a href="https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/mwangy%40gmail.com" target="_blank">https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/mwangy%40gmail.com</a><br><br>The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.<br><br>KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#888888'><br><br clear=all><span class=hoenzb><o:p></o:p></span></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span class=hoenzb><span style='color:#888888'>-- </span><o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='color:#888888'>Regards,<br><br>Mark Mwangi<br><br><a href="http://markmwangi.me.ke" target="_blank">markmwangi.me.ke</a><br><br><br><br></span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><br>_______________________________________________<br>kictanet mailing list<br><a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a><br><a href="https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet" target="_blank">https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet</a><br><br>Unsubscribe or change your options at <a href="https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/kisutsaxtian%40gmail.com" target="_blank">https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/kisutsaxtian%40gmail.com</a><br><br>The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.<br><br>KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.<o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div></div></body></html>
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any medium. Whilst our e-mails are checked for viruses, we cannot guarantee
that this message or any attachment is virus free, does not contain malicious
code or is incompatible with your electronic system and the Company does not
accept liability in respect of viruses, malicious code or any related problems
that you might experience. For further information about us, please contact us
at the address indicated below.</span></p><p style="line-height:115%"><span style="font-size:9pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Georgia,serif;background-color:white;background-repeat:initial initial"><br>Bernsoft Interactive Limited - P O Box 15177-00100 Nairobi - Tel: +254 722 929192 Email: <a href="mailto:admin@bernsoft.com" target="_blank">admin@bernsoft.com</a> Web: <a href="http://www.bernsoft.com" target="_blank">www.bernsoft.com</a> </span></p>