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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Dennis,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>We had an issue with Bernsoft.com but has since been resolved.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Regarding the article, for quite some time we have been involved in helping artists create content – which we still do. We opted to go through a more inclusive process by working with the Music Industry Association of Kenya –which we helped in establishing as well. This has been a better way to do it and we encourage organisations such as yours to help artists create content by sponsoring some less fortunate ones.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Which issue are you referring to that has a middleman?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Regards<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> kictanet [mailto:kictanet-bounces+bkioko=bernsoft.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Dennis Kioko via kictanet<br><b>Sent:</b> Friday, January 30, 2015 11:48 AM<br><b>To:</b> bkioko@bernsoft.com<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [kictanet] Music Copyright Owners sue ISPs for allowing Kenyans to download content illegally<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>DHL is a "host" and not an "ISP" , an ISP is equivalent of a road here. <br><br>Our of curiosity, why is <a href="http://bernsoft.com">bernsoft.com</a> suspended? <o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>I also don't understand this related issue <a href="http://www.the-star.co.ke/news/article-153378/bernsoft-stops-direct-financing-artistes">http://www.the-star.co.ke/news/article-153378/bernsoft-stops-direct-financing-artistes</a> , shouldn't the issue be left to the artist and their producer, who do they have to go through a middleman?<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>I keep saying that in Kenya we are lucky not to have regulation governing lots of stuff, it gives us the opportunity to innovate. If we had regulated M-Pesa, it would probably have stated that you require a phone with a physical keyboard and a 2G network, which technology is quickly moving away from. <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>If the issue is our culture of not paying for stuff, how will copyright holders police me sharing my music folder on the cloud to my friends, or sharing my Mp3 collection via bluetooth or flashdisk? <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>I think copyright holders should be working on enabling buyers, otherwise they will be caught up in an expensive and fruitless war pitting them and ISPs. ISPs are not customers, they just deliver Internet. <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>On Fri Jan 30 2015 at 09:41:56 David Makali via kictanet <<a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Wrong analogy, James. You do not ask NTSA but you apprehend the vehicle owner/driver/The transporter. Try and ferry your Bhang with DHL or even Easy Coach if you know what I mean. You have to declare your goods! Same to those who want to use the ISP. Vicarious liability...<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>David<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><br><br>This is official mail. If you doubt the content, call back on +254722517540.<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><br>On Jan 29, 2015, at 3:09 PM, James Mbugua via kictanet <<a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Bernard,<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>I asked you, Can you sue NTSA for allowing Bhang to be transported on our roads?<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>???<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Exactly, how the hell are they supposed to know who is transporting bhang?<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>In your case, exactly how the hell are ISPs supposed to know you are downloading music illegally?<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>You guys are just looking for traction here....the people you should talk to are Kenic if they registered them and the owners of the servers where these sites are hosted. ISPs have nothing to do with this.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>James<o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><img border=0 width=1 height=1 id="_x0000_i1025" src="http://t.signauxneuf.com/e1t/o/5/f18dQhb0S7ks8dDMPbW2n0x6l2B9gXrN7sKj6v5df9RN64kxbFRYHc-N8rBqW6QFLCHW5wfQ8G1k1H6H0?si=5495672839077888&pi=ddd43ffd-05df-4d91-ab47-ab1f8fe7c48c"><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>On Thu, Jan 29, 2015 at 3:04 PM, Bernard Kioko via kictanet <<a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><p>At one point many ppl didn't believe mpesa would be possible.. It took intervention from the late minister michuki.... <o:p></o:p></p><p>We r country used to being first in many things<o:p></o:p></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>On Jan 29, 2015 2:59 PM, "Mark Kipyegon via kictanet" <<a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>From a technical standpoint how feasible is it to simply blacklist sites?<br><br>Clone sites and proxies exist to circumvent these blocks.<br><br><br>On 29/01/2015 14:48, Bernard Kioko via kictanet wrote:<br>> James i posted a link where high court in UK ruled those same sites be<br>> blocked by ISPs and that's happening.<br>><br>> What's ur comment on that?<br>> On Jan 29, 2015 2:43 PM, "James Mbugua via kictanet" <<br>> <a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>> wrote:<br>><br>>> Listers,<br>>><br>>> Hmm...I don't know why I get the feeling this is a case of throwing mud at<br>>> the wall to see if it will stick.<br>>><br>>> ISPs have never been held liable for downloading illegal content anywhere<br>>> in the world. From the get go let us dispense with that. Neither will they<br>>> be found so in this case.<br>>><br>>> I remember vividly when Napster came out and also when Kazaa<br>>> followed....groups went after the sites not the ISPs. To this day, it is<br>>> piracy sites that even the FBI goes for not the likes of Comcast or AT$T.<br>>> Data privacy does not allow you to start checking what your customer is<br>>> downloading or uploading....this is not China and getting into that<br>>> territory is very dangerous for people's rights.<br>>><br>>> Let these guys do the hard work and go for the piracy sites or sue NTSA<br>>> for allowing bhang to be transported on our roads.<br>>><br>>> lol<br>>><br>>> Regards,<br>>><br>>> James<br>>><br>>><br>>><br>>> On Thu, Jan 29, 2015 at 2:30 PM, Davis Onsakia via kictanet <<br>>> <a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>> wrote:<br>>><br>>>> Will be an interesting case to keep the eye on.<br>>>><br>>>> What is not in doubt is that the final ruling will set a very serious<br>>>> precedent on how to deal with copyright issues when it comes to the Online<br>>>> World.<br>>>><br>>>> Best Regards,<br>>>> Davis M Onsakia<br>>>> "One doesn't discover new lands without consenting to lose sight of the<br>>>> shore for a very long time."<br>>>><br>>>> On 29 January 2015 at 13:46, Bernard Kioko via kictanet <<br>>>> <a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>> wrote:<br>>>><br>>>>> Reading from the article it says there is a list.<br>>>>> On Jan 29, 2015 1:23 PM, "Dennis Kioko" <<a href="mailto:dmbuvi@gmail.com" target="_blank">dmbuvi@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>>>>><br>>>>>> Does Kenya have necessary laws, and do the copyright holders have a<br>>>>>> list of infringing sites?<br>>>>>><br>>>>>> On Thu, 29 Jan 2015 13:04 Bernard Kioko <<a href="mailto:bkioko@bernsoft.com" target="_blank">bkioko@bernsoft.com</a>> wrote:<br>>>>>><br>>>>>>><br>>>>>>> <a href="http://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.php/2014/11/uk-high-court-forces-big-isps-block-56-new-internet-piracy-websites.html" target="_blank">http://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.php/2014/11/uk-high-court-forces-big-isps-block-56-new-internet-piracy-websites.html</a><br>>>>>>> On Jan 29, 2015 12:51 PM, "Dennis Kioko via kictanet" <<br>>>>>>> <a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>> wrote:<br>>>>>>><br>>>>>>>> Interesting case, though I wonder how ISPs allow people to allow<br>>>>>>>> content illegally. Any one with some insight?<br>>>>>>>> <a href="http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Corporate-News/Music-copyright-owners-illegal-downloads/-/539550/2605386/-/na4mbsz/-/index.html" target="_blank">http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Corporate-News/Music-copyright-owners-illegal-downloads/-/539550/2605386/-/na4mbsz/-/index.html</a><br>>>>>>>><br>>>>>>>><br><br>_______________________________________________<br>kictanet mailing list<br><a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a><br><a href="https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet" target="_blank">https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet</a><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal>Unsubscribe or change your options at <a href="https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/bkioko%40bernsoft.com" target="_blank">https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/bkioko%40bernsoft.com</a><br><br>The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.<br><br>KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div><div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><strong><hr size=2 width="100%" align=center></strong></div><p style='line-height:115%'><img border=0 id="_x0000_i1027" src="http://bernsoft.com/img/logo.jpg"><span style='font-size:9.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Georgia","serif";background:white'><br><br>This e-mail and any attachments may contain information that is confidential, legally privileged and protected by law and is intended for the sole use of the named recipient(s). 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For further information about us, please contact us at the address indicated below.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p style='line-height:115%'><span style='font-size:9.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Georgia","serif";background:white'><br>Bernsoft Interactive Limited - P O Box 15177-00100 Nairobi - Tel: <a href="tel:%2B254%20722%20929192" target="_blank">+254 722 929192</a> Email: <a href="mailto:admin@bernsoft.com" target="_blank">admin@bernsoft.com</a> Web: <a href="http://www.bernsoft.com" target="_blank">www.bernsoft.com</a> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><br>_______________________________________________<br>kictanet mailing list<br><a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a><br><a href="https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet" target="_blank">https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet</a><br><br>Unsubscribe or change your options at <a href="https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/jgmbugua%40gmail.com" target="_blank">https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/jgmbugua%40gmail.com</a><br><br>The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.<br><br>KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.<o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div></div></blockquote></div><div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>_______________________________________________<br>kictanet mailing list<br><a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a><br><a href="https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet" target="_blank">https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet</a><o:p></o:p></p></div></blockquote></div><div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal>Unsubscribe or change your options at <a href="https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/dmakali%40yahoo.com" target="_blank">https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/dmakali%40yahoo.com</a><o:p></o:p></p></div></blockquote></div><div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><br><br>The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.<br><br>KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.<o:p></o:p></p></div></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal>_______________________________________________<br>kictanet mailing list<br><a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" target="_blank">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a><br><a href="https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet" target="_blank">https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet</a><br><br>Unsubscribe or change your options at <a href="https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/dmbuvi%40gmail.com" target="_blank">https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/dmbuvi%40gmail.com</a><br><br>The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. 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