Assuming you were a law enforcer Alex what would you propose?<br><br>Best Regards<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Oct 17, 2012 at 2:40 PM, Alex Comninos <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:alex.comninos@gmail.com" target="_blank">alex.comninos@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">@Kivuva<br>
<br>
I stongly agree with your concerns. I would not want all cybercafe<br>
owners monitoring my communications, and I would be very afraid of the<br>
circumstances.<br>
<br>
I also worry about the costs this would impose on cybercafes, which<br>
would be transferred to the consumers as barriers to access when<br>
cybercafes either increase their prices, or simply stop operating<br>
because they cannot deal with the costs.<br>
<br>
Furthermore alot of cybercafes operate in the informal economy, they<br>
need to be integrated into the formal economy before this happens.<br>
Demanding they install surveillance equipment would disincentivise<br>
them to embark on such a process.<br>
<br>
Crime and hate speech are a big problem, but it cannot be solved<br>
without a vast array of negative consequences by requiring<br>
intermediaries to act as policeman.<br>
<br>
In the history of the postal service in most countries other than<br>
totalitarian states, the post office (pre-information society<br>
intermediaries) where never required to open every letter sent to<br>
check it did not contain hate speech or planning of crimes. Imagine<br>
the outrage. Would anyone on this list like to see the post-office<br>
reading all their letters?<br>
<div><div class="h5"><br>
On 17 October 2012 13:16, Kivuva <<a href="mailto:Kivuva@transworldafrica.com">Kivuva@transworldafrica.com</a>> wrote:<br>
> It seems we are entering the age of hyper-surveillance and monitoring.<br>
> Personal freedom and space should be protected as we try to find a<br>
> balance between prosecuting hate speech offenders and monitor peoples<br>
> day to day lives. When NCIS says it will work with cyber cafes to curb<br>
> vices, all I see is key-loggers installed in those workstations to<br>
> track what patrons are doing. I acknowledge that the safety of the<br>
> nation is important, but I fear what other uses such private<br>
> information may have, especially if it falls in the wrong hands!<br>
><br>
> On 17/10/2012, Grace Githaiga <<a href="mailto:ggithaiga@hotmail.com">ggithaiga@hotmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
>><br>
>> Thanks Ali, Barrack and Jaco. The message is clear: the education system as<br>
>> well as intermediaries have a role in educating users of their<br>
>> responsibility<br>
>> online.<br>
>><br>
>><br>
>><br>
>> Listers, please feel free to<br>
>> continue the debate under the thread of Hate<br>
>> text messages/KICA Section 29.<br>
>><br>
>><br>
>><br>
>> Today, we focus our attention to prosecution<br>
>> of online hate speech. The NCIC has threatened to prosecute online hate<br>
>> speech as political campaigns intensify ahead of the 2013 March general<br>
>> elections. The Chair of NCIS was quoted in<br>
>> yesterday’s Daily Nation as saying that his Commission is working with<br>
>> cyber<br>
>> cafes to monitor hate speech.<br>
>><br>
>><br>
>><br>
>> There seems to be uncertainty on what offences may happen on<br>
>> communication networks and whether intermediaries would be liable or not.<br>
>> Such<br>
>> intermediaries as Safaricom have come up with rules that will be applied<br>
>> for<br>
>> political advertising on its network; while Nation Media has NMG blog rules<br>
>> (see<br>
>> <a href="http://www.nation.co.ke/meta/-/1194/1132038/-/88lbspz/-/index.html" target="_blank">http://www.nation.co.ke/meta/-/1194/1132038/-/88lbspz/-/index.html</a>). NMG is<br>
>> cautious in particular after being sued<br>
>> for comments made by a reader on its blog on a story about Uhuru Kenyatta.<br>
>><br>
>><br>
>><br>
>> Is it advisable for these intermediaries to take caution or encourage<br>
>> self regulation or what should they do?<br>
>> How successful do you think the NCIC will be in prosecuting online hate<br>
>> speech?<br>
>><br>
>><br>
>> Over to you Listers.RgdsGG<br>
>><br>
>><br>
>><br>
>><br>
>> Subject: RE: [kictanet] Hate text messages/KICA Section 29<br>
>> Date: Tue, 16 Oct 2012 15:20:46 +0200<br>
>> From: <a href="mailto:j.dutoit@unesco.org">j.dutoit@unesco.org</a><br>
>> To: <a href="mailto:ggithaiga@hotmail.com">ggithaiga@hotmail.com</a><br>
>> CC: <a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>; <a href="mailto:isoc@orion.my.co.ke">isoc@orion.my.co.ke</a><br>
>><br>
>> Dear Grace, The education system definitely has a role to play in media and<br>
>> information literacy, but I would argue that it is also in the interest of<br>
>> the intermediaries to get involved in such education initiatives. Best<br>
>> regardsJaco -------------------------------------------------Jaco DU<br>
>> TOITAdviser for Communication & InformationUNESCO Regional Office for<br>
>> Eastern AfricaUnited Nations Avenue, UNON, Gigiri (Room C-104) P.O. Box<br>
>> 30592-00100, Nairobi, Kenya Tel: +254 (0)20 762 2346/2566 Fax +254 (0)20 762<br>
>> 2750 Mobile: +254 (0)728 610 912 <a href="mailto:Email%3Aj.dutoit@unesco.org">Email:j.dutoit@unesco.org</a>,<br>
>> Website: <a href="http://www.unesco-nairobi.org" target="_blank">http://www.unesco-nairobi.org</a> From: kictanet<br>
>> [mailto:<a href="mailto:kictanet-bounces%2Bj.dutoit">kictanet-bounces+j.dutoit</a>=<a href="mailto:unesco.org@lists.kictanet.or.ke">unesco.org@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>] On Behalf<br>
>> Of Grace Githaiga<br>
>> Sent: Tuesday, 16 October, 2012 3:57 PM<br>
>> To: Du Toit, Jaco<br>
>> Cc: <a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>; <a href="mailto:isoc@orion.my.co.ke">isoc@orion.my.co.ke</a><br>
>> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Hate text messages/KICA Section 29 Thanks Barrack,<br>
>> Jaco and Kariuki for your views. Jaco, we note your point on the need for<br>
>> users to take responsibility on what they post and the need for information<br>
>> and media literacy for users. Barrack is of the same opinion that there is<br>
>> need for an education of users on their responsibility online. If I may ask<br>
>> both of you, who would be responsible for conducting this sort of education?<br>
>> Kariuki, you make a very good point about what may have informed the<br>
>> introduction section 29 of KICA namely the facsimile. Considering that<br>
>> technology has evolved and the internet is no longer in infancy, what would<br>
>> you recommend for this section? Listers, lets here more input from you.<br>
>> RgdsGraceDate: Tue, 16 Oct 2012 09:47:13 +0300<br>
>> From: <a href="mailto:otieno.barrack@gmail.com">otieno.barrack@gmail.com</a><br>
>> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Hate text messages/KICA Section 29<br>
>> CC: <a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>; <a href="mailto:isoc@orion.my.co.ke">isoc@orion.my.co.ke</a><br>
>> To: <a href="mailto:ggithaiga@hotmail.com">ggithaiga@hotmail.com</a><br>
>><br>
>> GG,<br>
>><br>
>> Intermediaries are liable to a certain extent, when a computer broadcasts<br>
>> spam, its IP address is blacklisted and users might not be able to use it to<br>
>> send mail until corrective measures are taken. I beleive this is meant to<br>
>> ensure that the Intermediary is responsible for the content emanating from<br>
>> the network? if this is the case, why shouldn't the government which has a<br>
>> responsibility over the safety and security of every citizen not take the<br>
>> intermediary to court to produce the the real culprit? Imagine what would<br>
>> have happened in the the recent case when a child was kidnapped from a City<br>
>> Church if the Intermediary had not been of assistance to the state agencies,<br>
>> now that the populace understands the value of the Internet we should start<br>
>> educating them about their rights responsibility on the net same case<br>
>> applies to the Intermediaries, if this issues are not enshrined in the law<br>
>> it will be total chaos (looking at it from a government perspective)<br>
>><br>
>> Best RegardsOn Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 8:58 AM, John Kariuki<br>
>> <<a href="mailto:ngethe.kariuki2007@yahoo.co.uk">ngethe.kariuki2007@yahoo.co.uk</a>> wrote:Grace,Listers,Section 29 of KICA was<br>
>> first introduced in Kenya law in 1998 at the infancy of the Internet in<br>
>> Kenya and was based mainly on experience of Facsimile.It was, in my view, at<br>
>> that time not intended for intermediaries.However,if today a smart lawyer<br>
>> can adduce pursuasive evidence in court that indeed the intermediary was<br>
>> actually the 'sender' not mere 'carrier', I see no reason why he may not<br>
>> secure a conviction based on KICA section 29. John Kariuki. From: Grace<br>
>> Githaiga <<a href="mailto:ggithaiga@hotmail.com">ggithaiga@hotmail.com</a>><br>
>> To: <a href="mailto:ngethe.kariuki2007@yahoo.co.uk">ngethe.kariuki2007@yahoo.co.uk</a><br>
>> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <<a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>><br>
>> Sent: Tuesday, 16 October 2012, 1:02<br>
>> Subject: [kictanet] Hate text messages/KICA Section 29 Good morning Listers<br>
>> I would like to thank Jane, Barrack and Topista for views expressed on<br>
>> yesterday's topic Shooting the messenger. They did express the need to place<br>
>> some level of responsibility on both the source of the content and the host<br>
>> platform. Further they underscored the need to have a good information<br>
>> system that operates under a sound policy framework if it is to be useful to<br>
>> society. Today we look at Section 29 of the KICA (improper use of system)<br>
>> <a href="http://www.cck.go.ke/regulations/downloads/KenyaInformation-Communications-Act-Final.pdf" target="_blank">http://www.cck.go.ke/regulations/downloads/KenyaInformation-Communications-Act-Final.pdf</a><br>
>> that is increasingly being used as a basis for criminal charges for users of<br>
>> technology based platforms. See example:<br>
>> <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9q7VmsYNsqE" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9q7VmsYNsqE</a> 29. A person who by means of a<br>
>> licensed telecommunication system— (a) sends a message or other matter that<br>
>> is grossly offensive or of an indecent, obscene or menacing character; or<br>
>> (b) sends a message that he knows t<br>
>> o be false for the purpose of causing annoyance, inconvenience or needless<br>
>> anxiety to another person commits an offence and shall be liable on<br>
>> conviction to a fine not exceeding fifty thousand shillings, or to<br>
>> imprisonment for a term not exceeding three months, or to both. Could<br>
>> misuse of an information system also be used to charge intermediaries? Would<br>
>> this call for the training of the Kenya Police, DPP and Judiciary so that<br>
>> they understand the issues as they litigate and make rulings? Listers, lets<br>
>> hear your views. Further, please feel free to go back to yesterday's thread<br>
>> on shooting the messenger if you would like to contribute. Have a wonderful<br>
>> day RgdsGG _______________________________________________<br>
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>> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for<br>
>> people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and<br>
>> regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT<br>
>> sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and<br>
>> development.<br>
>><br>
>> KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors<br>
>> online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth,<br>
>> share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do<br>
>> not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.<br>
>><br>
>> --<br>
>> Barrack O. Otieno<a href="tel:%2B254721325277" value="+254721325277">+254721325277</a><a href="tel:%2B254-20-2498789" value="+254202498789">+254-20-2498789</a><br>
>> Skype: barrack.otienohttp://<a href="http://www.otienobarrack.me.ke/" target="_blank">www.otienobarrack.me.ke/</a><br>
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>> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for<br>
>> people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and<br>
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>> sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.<br>
>> KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors<br>
>> online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth,<br>
>> share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do<br>
>> not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.<br>
><br>
><br>
> --<br>
> ______________________<br>
> Mwendwa Kivuva<br>
> For<br>
> Business Development<br>
> Transworld Computer Channels<br>
> Cel: <a href="tel:0722402248" value="+254722402248">0722402248</a><br>
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<div class="HOEnZb"><div class="h5">><br>
> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.<br>
><br>
> KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.<br>
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.<br>
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</div></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><br>-- <br>Barrack O. Otieno<div>+254721325277</div><div>+254-20-2498789<br>Skype: barrack.otieno</div><div><a href="http://www.otienobarrack.me.ke/" target="_blank">http://www.otienobarrack.me.ke/</a>
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