<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"><html><head><meta content="text/html; charset=utf-8" http-equiv="Content-Type"></head><body>Just to clarify<br/><br/>Am not a top anything (that's for the big boys)... I strongly believe that our work should speak for itself<br/><br/>So in building KITOS or whatever we will call that org, we should focus on what we can do as a sector... Then govt may follow<br/><br/>Not start asking that all Kenyan projects should be done by Kenyan firms... Technically, all these "Kenyan Firms" have foreign shareholders...<br/><br/>Thanks<div>Sent from my BlackBerry®</div><hr/><div><b>From: </b> Dennis Kioko <dmbuvi@gmail.com>
</div><div><b>Date: </b>Mon, 23 Apr 2012 12:25:11 +0300</div><div><b>To: </b><agostal@gmail.com></div><div><b>Cc: </b>KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke></div><div><b>Subject: </b>Re: [kictanet] [KICTAnet] CCK hosting its website abroad</div><div><br/></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On 23 April 2012 12:20, <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:agostal@gmail.com" target="_blank">agostal@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
In all these discussions, I think Kenya should avoid creating some form of affirmative action when it comes to contracts.<br>
<br>
Companies in Rwanda may grow because foreigners have to work with them... But are they technically competent<br>
<br>
There are conversations going on right now around 140 friday about how to strengthen the sector... For me, I think we should build good quality stuff or do good quality work and the contracts will flow<br>
<br>
You win some, you loose some :)<br></blockquote><div>+1 on Agosta's comments , plus him being one of our top software exporters, they should be valid . </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<br>
Sent from my BlackBerry®<br>
<div><div class="h5"><br>
-----Original Message-----<br>
From: Phares Kariuki <<a href="mailto:pkariuki@gmail.com">pkariuki@gmail.com</a>><br>
Sender: kictanet-bounces+agostal=gmail.com@lists.kictanet.or.keDate: Mon, 23 Apr 2012 10:56:52<br>
To: Agosta Liko<<a href="mailto:agostal@gmail.com">agostal@gmail.com</a>><br>
Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<<a href="mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke">kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>><br>
Subject: Re: [kictanet] [KICTAnet] CCK hosting its website abroad<br>
<br>
My comments on the issue:<br>
<br>
The government does have a prerogative to develop local industries. A<br>
simple example is Embraer in Brazil, which grew to it’s current level<br>
(with Kenya Airways buying jets from it) primarily from the government<br>
purchasing. We don’t want the government to run the companies in the<br>
ICT space, just use the taxes it collects from us to develop the very<br>
same industries.<br>
<br>
If the private sector has it’s act together (as is the case with many<br>
companies e.g. Cellulant, which has won a contract from the Government<br>
of Nigeria recently, Seven Seas etc) and we have the capacity, it’s<br>
wrong for the government to outsource the work… The government of<br>
Rwanda currently has a model that for large government contracts, you<br>
have to work in tandem with a local firm, which has two companies<br>
(Rock Global Consulting & Matrix Business Solutions) experience<br>
accelerated growth and are now capable of handling a lot of the<br>
business the government has without external partnerships. They have<br>
grown their capacity. The government loses less money and this in a<br>
small way, fixes their balance of trade and increases employment<br>
locally.<br>
<br>
The US government is currently trying as much as possible to end<br>
outsourcing with companies like Apple/Cisco etc.<br>
<br>
I am not saying that we should adopt a model that was used by<br>
India/China in the mid-late twentieth Century (extreme market<br>
protection) but I believe it should be tempered. Importing milk from<br>
Tanzania for example, will simply kill our dairy industry. Market<br>
protection has it’s ills as well, but if well done, grows your<br>
economy.<br>
<br>
I agree, to a point, with Joe’s approach, however, with CCK, given the<br>
nature of their business, will necessarily have most of their traffic<br>
being local. We do have some good local hosting companies. If for<br>
instance, the tender was inclusive of all that and a preference for<br>
local hosting (if the website were to be local) or international (in<br>
this case the US), then this should clearly be specified at the tender<br>
stage.<br>
<br>
The government wants to have 500 companies the size of Seven Seas<br>
technologies (according to what I read from the recently ended<br>
Connected Kenya Summit – correct me if I’m wrong<br>
<a href="http://softkenya.com/kenya-ict-board-plans-500-new-firms-by-2017-to-push-kenya-to-top-10-ict-hubs/" target="_blank">http://softkenya.com/kenya-ict-board-plans-500-new-firms-by-2017-to-push-kenya-to-top-10-ict-hubs/</a>)<br>
which basically means that in the next five years, we will have, 500<br>
companies with over 1B KES in revenue (500B KES – 6.01B USD, with<br>
current rates). How are we ever going to achieve this if the<br>
government (currently the largest consumer of ICT Services) does not<br>
channel it’s resources into local firms?<br>
<br>
On Mon, Apr 23, 2012 at 10:07 AM, Eugene Lidede (Synergy)<br>
<<a href="mailto:eugene@synergy.co.ke">eugene@synergy.co.ke</a>> wrote:<br>
> I find it hypocritical, that we want to be at the forefront of lobbying<br>
> government to outsource locally, but when that is done, we in turn outsource<br>
> abroad using sleek phrases and acronyms like BPO/ITES, Lack of Capacity,<br>
> Costs, Security… the list is endless!<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> While I see the argument you are raising for local support, I think there is<br>
> a bigger question as to whether the Internet is local? Also how many of the<br>
> local hosting companies are locally owned?<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> The Internet is as local as the Internet is abroad and vice-versa. The<br>
> question of whether a firm is locally owned or not, is a “local-hosting”<br>
> irrelevancy that needs to be addressed differently. It may be entertaining<br>
> to watch Nigerian oga movies produced in Abuja, it would be better to see a<br>
> few Kenyan actors star in those movies and a few scenes shot in Kajiado, the<br>
> best experience is to have a hearty laugh watching hilarious Naswa/Pasua<br>
> comedy clips.… whether some Nigerian owns the production company behind<br>
> Naswa is equally an irrelevancy as far as “local-do-it-ourselves” goes.<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> The net effect of every shilling spent in Kenya as opposed to being<br>
> converted to dollars and spent abroad, is pretty straight forward I should<br>
> think. I find it hypocritical (if not defeatist – and bordering on an<br>
> economic crime) that a company “saves” by hosting abroad and later claims to<br>
> partake in CSR activities and benefits from Tax incentives for the phony<br>
> CSR!<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> It would be great if as an industry we answer some key questions and then<br>
> decide whether it is beneficial to use "local" or imported. My phone is<br>
> Korean, Laptop Apple (Chinese or US - you decide), Office furniture from a<br>
> South African company, imported from Italy etc..<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> I want to believe that the decision to import an Apple computer is more<br>
> informed by the lack of a local alternative in functionality, aesthetics,<br>
> prestige or some peculiar sentimental value. If only there was a local brand<br>
> called Chungwa that could equally tickle your gadgetry taste buds….. The<br>
> same “lacking” cannot be claimed for local hosting.<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> How many Kenyans are in the Diaspora and using the Internet.<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> What difference does it make? If anything, they ought to be on the frontline<br>
> advancing our cause as a “hosting”/ICT destination, while we develop the<br>
> requisite capacity to absorb the business they forward our way. I think it<br>
> is immoral from a policy perspective to target the Diasporas while 40<br>
> million are languishing in traffic Jams and endless dropped calls, just to<br>
> mention a few of the “easiest-to-solve” of our local ICT problems…<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> America did not just wake up July 4th and decide to outsource software<br>
> development to India or hardware to China. It is the nationals of these<br>
> countries residing/visiting America who built their respective cases and<br>
> they did so with the confidence that back home there was sufficient capacity<br>
> and capability. Unlike in our case, they managed to do so despite language<br>
> and accent barriers and differences in political ideology and nuclear<br>
> capability. We seem to have our cart in front of the horse, expecting the<br>
> IBMs and Googles of this world to come develop capacity for us then swing us<br>
> some!<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> I think you are asking the wrong question. You should be asking about the<br>
> quality of service to the visitor of the site. Various considerations go<br>
> into where to host a service;<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> With respect to CCK hosting, for as long as they are dealing with a middle<br>
> man (aka Broker/Reseller) then topics like Security, Quality of Service<br>
> ought not to arise, and if they do, then the contract ought to go to a firm<br>
> with demonstrated local infrastructure.<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> Regards<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> From: kictanet-bounces+eugene=<a href="mailto:synergy.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke">synergy.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a><br>
> [mailto:<a href="mailto:kictanet-bounces%2Beugene">kictanet-bounces+eugene</a>=<a href="mailto:synergy.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke">synergy.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke</a>] On<br>
> Behalf Of Joseph Mucheru<br>
> Sent: Sunday, April 22, 2012 11:38 PM<br>
> To: Eugene Lidede<br>
> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<br>
> Subject: Re: [kictanet] CCK hosting its website abroad<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> Grace/Wanjiku,<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> While I see the argument you are raising for local support, I think there is<br>
> a bigger question as to whether the Internet is local? Also how many of the<br>
> local hosting companies are locally owned? I think you should evaluate the<br>
> total economic impact to Kenya and not base it on face value. It would be<br>
> great if as an industry we answer some key questions and then decide whether<br>
> it is beneficial to use "local" or imported. My phone is Korean, Laptop<br>
> Apple (Chinese or US - you decide), Office furniture from a South African<br>
> company, imported from Italy etc.. back to the subject of local hosting<br>
> ..... How many Kenyans are in the diaspora and using the Internet. I think<br>
> you are asking the wrong question. You should be asking about the quality of<br>
> service to the visitor of the site. Various considerations go into where to<br>
> host a service;<br>
><br>
> 1) Cost<br>
><br>
> 2) Security<br>
><br>
> 3) Quality of Service - where is your primary audience, what devices (mobile<br>
> (feature or smart phone?, desktop, tablet )<br>
><br>
> 4) Search Engine Ranking and optimisation - Discoverability<br>
><br>
> 5) others ...<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> Who is best positioned to provide this kind of comparison data? Can you<br>
> investigate and give us feedback?<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> Thanks<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> Joe Mucheru<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> On Sun, Apr 22, 2012 at 11:01 PM, Grace Githaiga <<a href="mailto:ggithaiga@hotmail.com">ggithaiga@hotmail.com</a>><br>
> wrote:<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> Quoting the article by Rebecca Wanjiku...<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> For a regulator like the Communications Commission of Kenya (CCK), you would<br>
> expect them to be promoting services if the whole talk of how infrastructure<br>
> has improved and how it is getting better.<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> Read more...<br>
><br>
> <a href="http://www.wanjiku.co.ke/2012/04/cck-hosting-its-website-abroad/" target="_blank">http://www.wanjiku.co.ke/2012/04/cck-hosting-its-website-abroad/</a><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> Rgds<br>
><br>
> GG<br>
><br>
><br>
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><br>
> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for<br>
> people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and<br>
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> sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.<br>
><br>
> KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors<br>
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> share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do<br>
> not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.<br>
<br>
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Warm Regards,<br>
<br>
Phares Kaboro Kariuki<br>
<br>
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</div></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><div><br></div>-- <br>with Regards:<div><br><div><a href="http://www.denniskioko.com/" target="_blank">blog.denniskioko.com</a><div><div><br></div></div></div></div><br>
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