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<DIV dir=ltr align=left><FONT color=#0000ff size=2
face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=187191405-28042010><FONT color=#0000ff
size=2 face=Arial>All,</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=187191405-28042010><FONT color=#0000ff
size=2 face=Arial></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=187191405-28042010><FONT color=#0000ff
size=2 face=Arial>This should settle this debate. A rep of the media house who
earlier reported, should take responsibility for misleading info and
</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=187191405-28042010><FONT color=#0000ff
size=2 face=Arial>duly apologise, if on this list..</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=187191405-28042010><FONT color=#0000ff
size=2 face=Arial></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=187191405-28042010><FONT color=#0000ff
size=2 face=Arial>Let not this forum degenerate into a debate pitting
opposing religions. We have quite alot in the field that pertains ICT, do deal
with.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=187191405-28042010><FONT color=#0000ff
size=2 face=Arial></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=187191405-28042010><FONT color=#0000ff
size=2 face=Arial>Regards,</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=187191405-28042010><FONT color=#0000ff
size=2 face=Arial>Harry</FONT></SPAN></DIV><BR>
<DIV dir=ltr lang=en-us class=OutlookMessageHeader align=left>
<HR tabIndex=-1>
<FONT size=2 face=Tahoma><B>From:</B>
kictanet-bounces+harry=comtelsys.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke
[mailto:kictanet-bounces+harry=comtelsys.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke] <B>On
Behalf Of </B>Fatma Bashir<BR><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, April 28, 2010 8:07
AM<BR><B>To:</B> harry@comtelsys.co.ke<BR><B>Cc:</B> KICTAnet ICT Policy
Discussions<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: [kictanet] Red Card for the
Sheikhs<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>
<DIV></DIV><SPAN
style="BORDER-COLLAPSE: collapse; FONT-FAMILY: arial, sans-serif; FONT-SIZE: 13px"
class=Apple-style-span>r Listers,
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Please see below, from Nation Media website: link is: <SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Microsoft Sans Serif'; WHITE-SPACE: pre; FONT-SIZE: 12px"><A
style="COLOR: rgb(42,93,176)"
href="http://www.nation.co.ke/News/PC%20says%20Govt%20shut%20down%20video%20dens/-/1056/907416/-/111hh3i/-/index.html"
target=_blank>http://www.nation.co.ke/News/PC%20says%20Govt%20shut%20down%20video%20dens/-/1056/907416/-/111hh3i/-/index.html</A></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3 face="'Microsoft Sans Serif'"><SPAN
style="WHITE-SPACE: pre; FONT-SIZE: 12px"><BR></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman', Times, serif; COLOR: rgb(51,51,51); FONT-SIZE: 14px">
<DIV>
<P style="LINE-HEIGHT: 1.3em; MARGIN: 0px 0px 1em">The government has claimed
responsibility for a crackdown on video dens in North Eastern
Province.</P></DIV>
<DIV
style="PADDING-BOTTOM: 8px; BACKGROUND-COLOR: rgb(237,237,237); MARGIN: 0px 15px 10px 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 10px; WIDTH: 160px; PADDING-RIGHT: 10px; FONT-FAMILY: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; FLOAT: left; FONT-SIZE: 12px; PADDING-TOP: 8px">
<P
style="LINE-HEIGHT: 1.3em; TEXT-TRANSFORM: uppercase; MARGIN: 0px 0px 5px; PADDING-LEFT: 13px; BACKGROUND-REPEAT: no-repeat; COLOR: rgb(51,51,51); FONT-SIZE: 10px; FONT-WEIGHT: bold">RELATED
STORIES</P>
<UL
style="PADDING-BOTTOM: 0px; LINE-HEIGHT: 1.5em; LIST-STYLE-TYPE: none; MARGIN: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 0px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; FONT-SIZE: 11px; PADDING-TOP: 0px">
<LI
style="PADDING-BOTTOM: 4px; LINE-HEIGHT: 1.3em; MARGIN: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 16px; PADDING-RIGHT: 4px; BACKGROUND-REPEAT: no-repeat; BORDER-TOP: rgb(218,218,218) 1px solid; PADDING-TOP: 4px"><A
style="COLOR: rgb(77,77,77); TEXT-DECORATION: none"
href="http://www.nation.co.ke/News/regional/Now%20Supkem%20bans%20DStv%20in%20North%20Eastern%20/-/1070/907312/-/qg8y6lz/-/index.html"
target=_blank>Now Supkem ‘bans’ DStv in North Eastern</A> </LI></UL></DIV>
<DIV>
<P style="LINE-HEIGHT: 1.3em; MARGIN: 0px 0px 1em" class=MsoNormal>The North
Eastern Provincial Commissioner James ole Seriani also reassured Multichoice
Kenya, the operator of the DSTv channels and the locals that neither the
government nor the clerics would interfere with the satellite
broadcaster.</P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P style="LINE-HEIGHT: 1.3em; MARGIN: 0px 0px 1em" class=MsoNormal>“I want to
clarify a report appearing in both the local print and broadcast media that
alleged that Sheikhs closed DSTv and video dens in Mandera. The truth is that
the Mandera district security committee met in September last year and resolved
to close all video dens,” the administrator said in a message sent out to the
media.</P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P style="LINE-HEIGHT: 1.3em; MARGIN: 0px 0px 1em" class=MsoNormal>According to
Mr Seriani, the district security committee was targeting halls that show
immoral videos, those that hide criminals and aliens, those that admit school
children when they are supposed to be in school and those that operate without
license or sell drugs.</P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P style="LINE-HEIGHT: 1.3em; MARGIN: 0px 0px 1em" class=MsoNormal>“Let me
emphasise that it is not the Sheikhs who banned the shows but the district
security committee and DSTv has not been banned.”</P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P style="LINE-HEIGHT: 1.3em; MARGIN: 0px 0px 1em" class=MsoNormal>The PC said
the security team has no reason to interfere with DSTv because it only shows
football, which he acknowledged was a popular sport in North Eastern.</P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P style="LINE-HEIGHT: 1.3em; MARGIN: 0px 0px 1em" class=MsoNormal>He was,
however, categorical that the provincial administration would carry on with the
crackdown until the illegal dens are wiped out.</P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P style="LINE-HEIGHT: 1.3em; MARGIN: 0px 0px 1em" class=MsoNormal>“We have the
support of all the leaders which gives us the impetus to carry on with the
clean-up,” he said. </P></DIV></SPAN>
<DIV class=gmail_quote>I think we all agree that this time, the media was
irresponsible in the way it reported this incident. Journalism calls for
responsibility, especially at a time when this country is trying to put in a new
constitutional order and to heal some of the wounds of the past. Any
person who loves children and believes in order and morality would laud the move
to shut down video dens that allow children to be exposed to vices such as
pornography, drugs and sexual abuse, whether Christian, Muslim, Hindu, Agnostic
or Atheist. Good governance is also about building a society in which all
persons are protected and particularly children, who are the most vulnerable of
the lot. </DIV>
<DIV class=gmail_quote><BR></DIV></DIV></SPAN>
<DIV class=gmail_quote>On Wed, Apr 28, 2010 at 7:38 AM, Wainaina Mungai <SPAN
dir=ltr><<A
href="mailto:wainaina@madeinkenya.org">wainaina@madeinkenya.org</A>></SPAN>
wrote:<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex"
class=gmail_quote>Fatma et al.<BR><BR>SOURCES: KTN news and other press
reports. See BBC reports online. I<BR>verified the TV reports and watched as
SUPKEM official lauded the<BR>move, stating how they should spread it to other
towns. Video<BR>play-back available.<BR><BR>DSTV & VIDEO DENS: See press
reports for my source & related details.<BR><BR>VIDEO DENS &
JURISDICTION: Even where it is 'well-intended', a<BR>religious leader has no
jurisdiction over businesses or legal issues<BR>such as the Muslim leaders
purported to 'out-law'. So, it is not their<BR>place to do so. That's the
point being drummed into Kenyans. You may<BR>lobby the government but you
cannot outlaw anything with the imagined<BR>mandate to do so.<BR><BR>SUPKEM: A
SUPKEM official was on TV stating how they should spread the<BR>same to other
towns. Wrong approach again: no jurisdiction. That's a<BR>point that needs to
get across otherwise, if Christians and Hindus<BR>enforced their ''laws'',
life would be very uncomfortable for<BR>non-Christians or
non-Hindus.<BR><BR>SECULAR STATE: The fact that the PM and President profess
any sort of<BR>religion does not make KENYA a religious state. We need to be
on the<BR>same page on that one. Those are (personal convictions). We do not
pay<BR>them to perform (religious duties) towards persons who
religiously<BR>agree with them. We pay them to deliver on totally
non-religious<BR>functions of government/State for all people or every
religion -<BR>including aethists. The Khadhi courts are financed for a
'religious<BR>function' that via the constitution is navigated into the realm
of<BR>state functions through the judiciary. The Kadhi Courts, if
retained<BR>in a Constitution, should be financed by those it is meant to
serve.<BR>Special funding using my taxes needs to go towards persons
with<BR>disabilities - not religious functions.<BR><BR>SHARIAH & KADHI
COURTS: I have to admit I do not know the connections.<BR>What I was refering
to is "Islamic teachings" that were quoted as the<BR>basis of the actions of
the said Sheikh and the what the SUPKEM<BR>official stated would be spread to
other towns. I may have dragged the<BR>wrong terminology along but well am
sure the point is clear. Your<BR>religious convictions do not give you
jurisdiction over anyone. We<BR>have adequate mechanisms (enforced or
otherwise) to address matters in<BR>a non-religious manner. The Mombasa Mayor
& councillors keep making<BR>that very same mistake of mixing religion
with their statutory role.<BR>That is dangerous in a polarised situation as we
what we have.<BR><BR>SHARIA & THE POOR: I admire the way (real) followers
of Islamic<BR>teachings take care of others through alms and their dedication
to<BR>virtue. I also admire how true Christians do the same and give
up<BR>wealth for others in what some would call socialism. I admire how
true<BR>Hindus build hospitals and give free healthcare. However, none
of<BR>these should issue decrees or apply religious teachings on people
who<BR>do not 'profess' that religion. We would have to agree on a
State<BR>religion if we start that debate. Governance in a secular state
(which<BR>is what we have in Kenya) does not require application of religion.
If<BR>Kenya was to become a religious state....well, we all know it would
be<BR>a Christian state...making things rather unbearable for people
who<BR>profess other religions.<BR><BR>DSTV/Multichoice made a business
decision not to ''jump onto the<BR>bandwagon'' (which included the Minister
Poghisio) of condemning the<BR>actions in Mandera. I would guess (& i may
be wrong ;-) ) it was not<BR>because they had a different conviction from that
of the 'bandwagon'.<BR>They needed a PR decision which does not apply in my
case. I need<BR>rights and freedoms enforced equally for all not because the
Bible,<BR>Koran or Torah says so....but bacuse it is the law of the
land.<BR><BR>DRUGS, HOMOSEXUALITY ETC: There is this growing trend at the
Coast<BR>where 'Islamic teachings' are being used by councillors, the Mayor
and<BR>Ministers from the region as their basis for fighting
drug-trafficking<BR>and homosexuality. Refer to statements by Mombasa Mayor
and Minister<BR>Balala in recent days (The Star). The basis for their
recommedations<BR>(though well-intended) shows the extent of the
misconceptions about<BR>the jurisdiction of religion in a secular state. The
basis for<BR>fightlng crime, drug abuse or whatever else they perceive to
be<BR>criminal is the KENYAN LAW - derived from Constitution,
legislation,<BR>regulation, council by-laws etc.<BR><BR>Overall, my point is
this: Religious leaders have a right to express<BR>concerns but have no
jurisdiction in enforcing matters of State. Kadhi<BR>courts are to me, the
product of such distorted views about the place<BR>of religion in a secular
state. In the draft constitution, we continue<BR>to propagate a situation that
favours one religion over others. The<BR>impact will become clear in a couple
of years.<BR><BR>I have no quarrel with Islam, neither do I need to know the
details of<BR>what is and what is not Islam or Hindu, Buddhist or Christian.
All I<BR>need is the principles of good governance that apply to ALL persons
in<BR>a secular state. In cases such as Mandera and Mombasa, we must
have<BR>safeguards against people who may be mistaken in believing they
have<BR>jurisdiction over others simply because they profess a faith
that<BR>tells them as much.<BR><BR>I hope we are now on the same
page.<BR><FONT color=#888888><BR>Wainaina<BR></FONT>
<DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV class=h5><BR>On 4/28/10, Fatma Bashir <<A
href="mailto:fatma.bashir@gmail.com">fatma.bashir@gmail.com</A>>
wrote:<BR>> Dear Listers,<BR>><BR>> I read the article in the papers
and tried to link the shariah law to<BR>> what I was reading in
vain....however tho late in response I felt it<BR>> would be appropriate to
share some personla views...<BR>><BR>> response to the first post sent (
by Wainaina)<BR>><BR>> I am not sure where the information came from
that the closing down of<BR>> video dens has anything to do with
enforcement of shari’ah law. It is<BR>> a matter of fact that video
dens, which are scattered all over the<BR>> less affluent regions of the
country, and mainly in slums, are<BR>> responsible for very many ills in
those areas. Talk to anyone living<BR>> in a slum in Nairobi and they
will testify to the fact that not only<BR>> are children missing school to
watch unsuitable movies, they are<BR>> picking up extremely bad habits from
these video dens and are being<BR>> exposed to sexual abuse by sexual
predators who not only give them the<BR>> entrance fee to watch some movies
but prey on them while they are in<BR>> those very dens. It is about
time somebody stood up to this.<BR>> Secondly, you must be more responsible
when making a statement such as<BR>> ‘outlaw DSTV video dens and related
activities’. The only thing that<BR>> was outlawed was the video dens
and it was done with the full support<BR>> of the local authorities.
If you live in Mandera and decide to<BR>> install DSTV in your own
house, then so be it but please, allow them<BR>> to take responsibility for
what their children are being fed by way of<BR>>
‘entertainment’<BR>><BR>> Anyone may watch supersport matches where they
please and drink smoke<BR>> etc but children must be protected. Try talking
to someone whose child<BR>> is exposed to this and lets hear what they have
to say.<BR>><BR>> This is not about kadhi’s courts, this is about
protecting children in<BR>> Kenya and clearly the authorities there felt
that it was an important<BR>> move to make, This is not about shariah
or the current/new<BR>> constitution or any of that..... but about right
thinking adults<BR>> seeking to protect children. It just so happens to be
a step taken by<BR>> a people in an area vastly populated by
Muslims...<BR>> I laud DSTV for not jumping on the bandwagon and making
rash comments<BR>> and connections but monitoring ( read gather correct
information) the<BR>> situation before putting egg on their faces...kudos
Isaboke and<BR>> Ondimu.<BR>><BR>> Kenya is not a secular state. If
it was, Raila would not go to such<BR>> lengths to get himself baptized,
and neither would the President going<BR>> to church on Sunday be attended
to by ministers and PSs and televised<BR>> to boot. Incidentally, I
would like to know who fuels his car and<BR>> pays for this bodyguards on
Sunday when he attends church – yes,<BR>> yours and my hard earned
taxes.<BR>><BR>> Let us try and be be responsible over some of the
connections we make<BR>> I think that there is no doubt that the kadhis
courts are about<BR>> personal, family and inheritance law for the Muslims
and in no way<BR>> affects non muslims...so please vote yes...Jesus does
say love your<BR>> neighbour.....so do love us please.<BR>><BR>> I
challenge wainaina et all to find out more about shariah<BR>>
law...especially its inception and framework of implementation before<BR>>
the law is applied....and rest assured that Kenya is no where ready<BR>>
for this......and not in our great grand childrens lifetimes either.<BR>>
Please get facts from a reputable book or institutions some of the<BR>>
drivel I have read....!!!!<BR>> kionjoo.....<BR>> Do you think that the
KRA would be ready and willing to take care of<BR>> the poor and
underpriviledged in this country by making sure that all<BR>> eat ( three
meals a day) get educated ( at public costs fully) have<BR>> roofs over
each and every head? using the taxes of the rich and<BR>> priveledged to
make sure that the poor and underpreviledged lead a<BR>> minimum acceptable
basic existence thus eliminating any reason to for<BR>> example
steal.......that is the FIRST demand shariah law would make<BR>> upon its
government.....yep Kenya not ready for this at all!<BR>><BR>><BR>>
Regards,<BR>> Fatma<BR>><BR>> PS, as I am not a scholar on
islamic studies the views above are<BR>> personla but anchored on my
limited understanding of fiqh islamic<BR>>
law..<BR>><BR>><BR>><BR>> On 4/27/10, Wainaina Mungai <<A
href="mailto:wainaina@madeinkenya.org">wainaina@madeinkenya.org</A>>
wrote:<BR>>> The recent move by Muslim Sheikhs to enforce Sharia Law,
outlaw DSTV,<BR>>> video dens & related activities in Mandera could
not have come at a<BR>>> more unfortunate time. The support they have
received from SUPREM<BR>>> (Supreme Council of Kenya Muslims) further
complicates the debate on<BR>>> the "continued" inclusion of Kadhi
Courts in our Constitution.<BR>>><BR>>> Now that the SUPKEM has
proved to support such apparent 'treason' in<BR>>> my secular nation,
President Kibaki and Prime Minister Odinga must<BR>>> also commit
to ensuring that religion and religious courts are omitted<BR>>> from
the new constitution. That is the pact they must sign with the NO<BR>>>
campaign if a YES vote is to sail through without question. No<BR>>>
religion, especially fundamentalist Islam, should enjoy the
privileges<BR>>> of my hard-earned taxes to propagate religious
activities that may<BR>>> disintegrate into such treasonable actions as
by the Sheikhs.<BR>>><BR>>> My vote would easily change to a
resounding "NO" unless I am assured<BR>>> by the Constitution that no
Sheikh or Buddist monk, Hindu priest or<BR>>> Christian cleric will get
away with the absurd audacity of attempting<BR>>> to determine where I
watch my Supersport matches, what I drink as I do<BR>>> so; where and
what I can smoke or drink in an independent secular<BR>>>
KENYA.<BR>>><BR>>> No religion should 'get it twisted' on its
place in secular Kenya and<BR>>> no loopholes should allow Sheikhs or
SUPKEM to get away with such<BR>>> treasonable
actions.<BR>>><BR>>> Regards,<BR>>>
Wainaina<BR>>><BR>>> --<BR>>> Sent from my mobile
device<BR>>><BR>>> Wainaina Mungai<BR>>> -----<BR>>>
<A href="http://www.bungesms.com"
target=_blank>http://www.bungesms.com</A><BR>>> <A
href="http://www.madeinkenya.org"
target=_blank>http://www.madeinkenya.org</A><BR>>> <A
href="http://www.wainainamungai.com"
target=_blank>http://www.wainainamungai.com</A><BR>>><BR>>>
Thousands of candles can be lighted from a single candle, and the
life<BR>>> of the candle will not be shortened. Happiness never
decreases by<BR>>> being shared. ~ Buddha~<BR>>><BR>>>
_______________________________________________<BR>>> kictanet mailing
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target=_blank>http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet</A><BR>>><BR>>>
This message was sent to: <A
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Unsubscribe or change your options at<BR>>> <A
href="http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/fatma.bashir%40gmail.com"
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<DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV class=h5>Sent from my mobile device<BR><BR>Wainaina Mungai<BR>-----<BR><A
href="http://www.bungesms.com" target=_blank>http://www.bungesms.com</A><BR><A
href="http://www.madeinkenya.org"
target=_blank>http://www.madeinkenya.org</A><BR><A
href="http://www.wainainamungai.com"
target=_blank>http://www.wainainamungai.com</A><BR><BR>Thousands of candles
can be lighted from a single candle, and the life<BR>of the candle will not be
shortened. Happiness never decreases by<BR>being shared. ~
Buddha~<BR></DIV></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV><BR></BODY></HTML>