<html><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div><br></div><div>Walu,</div><div>Placing this extract in the context of this discussion and your report on e-Governance we discussed 4 months ago...pg. 17....you forgot to include a fundamental issue.</div><div><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 10.0px Times New Roman; min-height: 11.0px"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000"> <br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></font></p><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal 'Times New Roman'; "><b><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000">Bill Kagai</font></i></b><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000"> doubted Brian's statement about the TEAMS project being “developmental” </font></i></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal 'Times New Roman'; "><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000">rather than “profit” oriented. In his rejoinder </font></i><b><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000">Brain Longwe</font></i></b><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000"> said that there were a </font></i></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal 'Times New Roman'; "><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000">number of different ways to go about major infrastructure development: </font></i></div><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Times New Roman; min-height: 15.0px"><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000"> <br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></font></i></p><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal 'Times New Roman'; "><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000">1.</font></i><span style="font: 12.0px Arial"><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000"> </font></i></span><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000">For-Profit: Putting together a business case with a clear Return-On-Investment </font></i></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal 'Times New Roman'; "><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000">(ROI) benefit; looking out for funding, then building and deploying. Hopefully </font></i></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal 'Times New Roman'; "><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000">the market would respond well and the investors get their return (e.g. SEACOM). </font></i></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal 'Times New Roman'; "><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000">2.</font></i><span style="font: 12.0px Arial"><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000"> </font></i></span><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000">Means-to-an-end: Determine the total costs for the project, approach the primary </font></i></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal 'Times New Roman'; "><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000">stakeholders; Oil companies in the case of oil pipelines, gas companies in the case </font></i></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal 'Times New Roman'; "><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000">of gas companies, operators and ISPs in the case of bandwidth; sell them the </font></i></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal 'Times New Roman'; "><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000">concept of delivering the commodity to themselves at cost (or as near to cost as </font></i></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal 'Times New Roman'; "><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000">possible); set up an "Operations and Maintenance" structure which levies the </font></i></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal 'Times New Roman'; "><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000">same parties; build and deploy; once the bandwidth is delivered it's a "free-for-all" </font></i></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal 'Times New Roman'; "><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000">in the marketplace - with ‘costs’ at a very low level, prices would eventually </font></i></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal 'Times New Roman'; "><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000">follow due to competition (e.g. TEAMs and EASSY) </font></i></div><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Times New Roman; min-height: 15.0px"><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000"> <br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></font></i></p><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal 'Times New Roman'; "><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000">He said this is was one of the main reasons why projects such as TEAMs and EASSY </font></i></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal 'Times New Roman'; "><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000">have faced stiff opposition, criticism and outright attempted sabotage – because they have </font></i></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal 'Times New Roman'; "><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000">the potential to cut the feet out from under any similar commercial venture. </font></i></div><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Times New Roman; min-height: 15.0px"><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000"> <br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></font></i></p><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal 'Times New Roman'; "><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000">In response </font></i><b><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000">Bill Kagai</font></i></b><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000"> stated the following </font></i></div><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Times New Roman; min-height: 15.0px"><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000"> <br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></font></i></p><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal 'Times New Roman'; "><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000">1.</font></i><span style="font: 12.0px Arial"><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000"> </font></i></span><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000">For Profit - Seacom -This sounded like a brilliant business and economic model. </font></i></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal 'Times New Roman'; "><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000">2.</font></i><span style="font: 12.0px Arial"><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000"> </font></i></span><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000">Means-to-an-end - TEAMS: Referencing his university economics this option </font></i></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal 'Times New Roman'; "><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000">appeared as the only economic model they did not teach at the University of </font></i></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal 'Times New Roman'; "><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000">Nairobi an institution established by an Act of Parliament. </font></i></div><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Times New Roman; min-height: 15.0px"><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000"> <br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></font></i></p><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal 'Times New Roman'; "><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000">In summary, he felt that TEAMs had already waged a price war with no products in the </font></i></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal 'Times New Roman'; "><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000">market yet and was skeptical that TEAMs would indeed be cheaper than SEACOM in </font></i></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal 'Times New Roman'; "><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0000">terms of costing internet service. </font></i></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Arial" size="3"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 12px;"><br></span></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Arial" size="3"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 12px;">.....You forgot to include that Brian promised to buy me kalovo should Seacom roll out faster and end up being cheaper than Teams. Haki yetu..</span></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="'Times New Roman'"><br></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="'Times New Roman'"><br></font></div><div><div>On Aug 17, 2009, at 1:10 PM, Walubengo J wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite"><div>MO, Alex,<br><br>Ease up abit. Dont imagine I dont want affordable internet prices. Infact if you had time and googled my online contributions over the last 5years, you will realize I have been raising the red-flag about fiber vis a viz pricing. The other day I reloaded my Safcom modem with 1,000/= (300MB service). It all disappeared within 5days! Previously before SEACOM it would take longer (3weeks) to disappear because of the slower speeds. Better speeds encourage faster and broader browsing but it hurts (financially) and its not funny. <br><br>I think our differences lie in the approach to having reduced prices. I chose the academic route because thats my background. Feel free to pursue your routes to reduced prices - but plse be cautious because the solution is NOT domiciled in ONE stakeholder. Its not with the Regulator, nor the techies, nor the activists, nor the Consumers, nor the Govt, nor the Media, etc. Instead I believe it is with ALL of the above. And it will be unfortunate to alienate any of them while pursuing reduced prices.<br><br>walu. <br>nb1: and thats why I had copied to what Alex calls my "home-tuff" (just ropping in other stakeholders).<br>nb2: I also note and do appreciated your legal counterarguments but decline to respond as at now since I will cover that and other issues during the upcoming ICT conference at SU (I think will be free to sambaza the paper thereafter for those interested).<br><br><br>--- On Mon, 8/17/09, mike oketch <<a href="mailto:mikeoketch@gmail.com">mikeoketch@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br><br><blockquote type="cite">From: mike oketch <<a href="mailto:mikeoketch@gmail.com">mikeoketch@gmail.com</a>><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">Subject: Re: [Skunkworks] the long fibre lie...Regulatory Action limited.<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">To: "Skunkworks forum" <<a href="mailto:skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke">skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke</a>><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">Date: Monday, August 17, 2009, 10:13 AM<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">Again<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">Safaricom CEO who is also heads the board of<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">TEAMS says that TEAMS benefits could not be realised because<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">onward connection with Europe has not been fully discussed.<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">How can you initiate a flight from Kenya to Nigeria without<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">getting the landing rights in Nigeria and flight clearance<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">for CAR, DRC, Sudan and all the countries you are going to<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">overfly?<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">Cheap Cheap Cheap and we wont be duped. I have<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">seen people in this list who support the crooked CEOs just<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">because they need favors for contracts and interviews for<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">their educations research papers. Hypocrites they are.<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">Lets be realistic<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">MO<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 9:10 AM,<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">mike oketch <<a href="mailto:mikeoketch@gmail.com">mikeoketch@gmail.com</a>><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">wrote:<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">Walubengo<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">Yours are just too simplistic than the<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">Alex's you are saying that are simplistic. The fact that<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">kenya could not regulate Oil prices doesnt mean that<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">Tanzania couldnt. The fact that SAT 3 operators couldnt be<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">regulated cannont mean that the operators here cannot be<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">regulated.<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">Stop all these fake comparisons. Prices must<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">come down and we will face them at every conference and<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">every Barcamp and will tell these unpatriotic who have<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">pocketed our PS off. Your arguments just dont wash.<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">MO<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 8:40 AM,<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">Walubengo J <<a href="mailto:jwalu@yahoo.com">jwalu@yahoo.com</a>><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">wrote:<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">Alex,<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">Your have rightly qaulified your solution - as simple.<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"> Indeed it is. Infact too simplistic to fly. The idea<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">that the Regulator can reign in Operators who charge<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">"high" internet rates cannot and will not work.<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"> Think about the in-famous SAT3 fiber link on the west<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">coast of africa. Ask yourself why the Regulators in<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">Nigeria, Ghana, Cameroon, Angola, S-Africa etc have never<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"> stepped in and revoked licensces of operators over the<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">last 15yrs of high internet costs offered on the fiber...<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">The answers are very complex...I will actually be<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">discussing these limitations and available interventions in<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">some upcoming ICT conference at Strath University in Sept 09<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">and I dont want to pre-empt ;-)....<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">walu.<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">--- On Fri, 8/14/09, Gakuru Alex <<a href="mailto:alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com">alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com</a>><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">wrote:<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">From: Gakuru Alex <<a href="mailto:alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com">alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com</a>><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Subject: Re: [Skunkworks] Fwd: the long fibre lie...<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">Ndemo should resign if internet prices do not drop as he<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">promised!!<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">To: "Skunkworks forum" <<a href="mailto:skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke">skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke</a>><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Date: Friday, August 14, 2009, 8:44 PM<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:38 PM,<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">David Kiania | Asentric Consulting<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Ltd<<a href="mailto:kianiadee@gmail.com">kianiadee@gmail.com</a>><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">wrote:<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Set the precedence what's your solution? Am<br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">sure if<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">you did we'd have<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">heard it by now. This thread is a knee jerk<br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">reaction<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">to a bad internet<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">day, we all have one.<br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Simple, the entity under Ndemo's docket that<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">grants these<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">cowboy<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">operators licenses puts it's foot down and warn<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">that I may<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">revoke<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">licenses for operators that charge waaaay up in the<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">sky not<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">just above<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">cost but ABOVE acceptable international pricing<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">benchmarks.<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">They've<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">all the data they need. Imagine, for example,<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">Safaricom on<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">the verge<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">of losing their license, price drops, drops, drops,<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">drops,<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">drops, and<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">drops..... across board.<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Would this be acceptable to 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