[kictanet] [labor issues] why Kenya should urgently BAN unpaid internships

Mon Apr 8 21:26:22 EAT 2019

Internships are a learning experience and should be paid for in the same
fashion we pay for education. The moment you get admission to intern for
three or so months in a company; that company becomes a learning
institution - systems have to adjust to accommodate you, someone has to be
in charge of supervising you at the expense of doing their daily duties.

If the learning that goes on today in our colleges is anything to go by
most interns are half baked and very labourious to mentor and train. They
therefore owe the company and should pay for the opportunity they are
getting.

On Fri, Apr 5, 2019 at 3:42 PM Ali Hussein via kictanet <
kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:

> Jimmy
>
> Before we discuss pay let's rather discuss the concept of apprenticeship
> and internship. Let's go back to the basics, way back when being an
> apprentice was something to be proud of. You were learning a trade. You
> were learning to be disciplined. You were learning to be a part of society.
> And society had a responsibility to you much like you had a responsibility
> to society. The ecosystem to enable comprised Universities, National and
> Village Polytechnics. The apprentices included graduates, Diploma Holders
> etc.
>
> The system is broken.
>
> Employers are misusing the system. Interns are misusing the systems.
> Society watches helplessly.
>
> This is the conversation we must have. Pay should be part of the bigger
> picture. Focusing on pay alone is missing the point.
>
> Regards
>
>
> * Ali Hussein*
>
> *Principal*
>
> *AHK & Associates*
>
>
>
> Tel: +254 713 601113
>
> Twitter: @AliHKassim
>
> Skype: abu-jomo
>
> LinkedIn: http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim
> <http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim>
>
>
> 13th Floor , Delta Towers, Oracle Wing,
>
> Chiromo Road, Westlands,
>
> Nairobi, Kenya.
>
> Any information of a personal nature expressed in this email are purely
> mine and do not necessarily reflect the official positions of the
> organizations that I work with.
>
>
> On Fri, Apr 5, 2019 at 2:04 PM Jimmy Gitonga <jimmygitts at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Ali,
>>
>> "Let us have candid conversations around changing mindsets  - both from
>> a corporate perspective and an internee/apprentice perspective.” is what
>> you said and my  "Swopping out internship with apprenticeship does not
>> answer the underlying question.” did not convey that I was agreeing with
>> you. I accept that.
>>
>> So to get to having candid conversations around changing mindsets, I
>> asked the questions; Who should pay for interns to flourish in private
>> organisations? Should the company pay for the labour? Should the intern pay
>> for the opportunity and experience?? Who owes who?
>>
>> Best Regards,
>> *Jimmy Gitonga*
>>
>> *Web Software Design and Development *
>> *LinkedIn: Jimmy Gitonga | Twitter: @Afrowave*
>> ______________________________________
>>
>> *Web*: afroshok.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 4 Apr 2019, at 4:35 PM, Ali Hussein <ali at hussein.me.ke> wrote:
>>
>> Jimmy
>>
>> I encourage you to read my email again. You seem to have missed my point.
>> :-)
>>
>> Regards
>>
>> *Ali Hussein*
>> *Principal*
>> *AHK & Associates*
>>
>>
>> Tel: +254 713 601113
>> Twitter: @AliHKassim
>> Skype: abu-jomo
>> LinkedIn: http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim
>> <http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim>
>>
>> 13th Floor , Delta Towers, Oracle Wing,
>> Chiromo Road, Westlands,
>> Nairobi, Kenya.
>>
>> Any information of a personal nature expressed in this email are purely
>> mine and do not necessarily reflect the official positions of the
>> organizations that I work with.
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 4, 2019 at 3:24 PM Jimmy Gitonga <jimmygitts at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hapo sawa Brathe, :-D
>>>
>>> I think what we are really asking is a societal question. Unpaid
>>> internships are not illegal. Swopping out internship with apprenticeship
>>> does not answer the underlying question.
>>>
>>> Why should internships be paid for? The answer is a social impact one,
>>> not a business one. It being construed as a business decision is what
>>> people are up in arms about. Internship is a "giving back", "paying
>>> forward” or “leg up" kind of thing.
>>>
>>> Who should pay for interns to flourish in private organisations? Should
>>> the company pay for the labour? Should the intern pay for the opportunity
>>> and experience?? Who owes who?
>>>
>>> With the best regards,
>>> *Jimmy Gitonga*
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 4 Apr 2019, at 11:23 AM, Ali Hussein <ali at hussein.me.ke> wrote:
>>>
>>> Jimmy
>>>
>>> Let me be clear and remove my 'cleverness' :-)
>>>
>>> My deep conviction is this:-
>>>
>>> We are bucking the wrong tree. Let's go back to the basics. Let's
>>> redefine what an internship/apprenticeship means. Firstly, let's accept
>>> that the internship concept has been so bastardized that it has lost
>>> meaning. I would like at this point to replace internship with
>>> apprenticeship. Apprenticeship used to mean:-
>>>
>>> *A person who is learning a trade from a skilled employer, having agreed
>>> to work for a fixed period at low wages.*
>>>
>>> Let us have candid conversations around changing mindsets  - both from a
>>> corporate perspective and an internee/apprentice perspective.
>>>
>>> Regards
>>>
>>> *Ali Hussein*
>>> *Principal*
>>> *AHK & Associates*
>>>
>>>
>>> Tel: +254 713 601113
>>> Twitter: @AliHKassim
>>> Skype: abu-jomo
>>> LinkedIn: http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim
>>> <http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim>
>>>
>>> 13th Floor , Delta Towers, Oracle Wing,
>>> Chiromo Road, Westlands,
>>> Nairobi, Kenya.
>>>
>>> Any information of a personal nature
>>>
>>>
>>>
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