[kictanet] Why Bill Gates would tax robots

Eric M K Osiakwan ericosiakwan at me.com
Wed Mar 1 10:25:47 EAT 2017 

The other day, my buddy David Pearson and I visited his mentor Bob Doyle who is an information philosopher <http://www.informationphilosopher.com/about/> (has become my friend as well) and his son Jeremy in their VR studio and after playing with the toys we sat to discuss VR, AI, AR and Robots and in that convo Bob postulated that Robots “could” develop their own free will - that scared the hell out of me and for the rest of that afternoon I would dwell on that thought deep into my sleep that night. 

Robots are currently slaves to humans but we know that robots have better eyesight, can work longer and better hours etc than humans so the import of Bob's postulation is that when (not if) Robots develop "free will” the master servant relationship would switch where we humans would become slaves to robots - I woke up the following day with this thought then it became clear to me why Elon Musk is worried that his friend Larry Page could destroy human kind and in the book “Elon Musk” by Ashlee Vanee, page 3 (Elon’s World) I quote “…He opened up about the major fear keeping him up at night: namely that Google cofounder and CEO Larry Page might well have been building a fleet of AI-enhanced robots capable of destroying mankind. “I’m really worried about this, “ Musk said….” - I have also being worried since.

Eric here 


Eric M.K Osiakwan
 "Accraboy" 4 Skype
@eosiakwan 4 Twitter
 www.ericosiakwan.com
+233244386792 4 WhatsApp

> On Mar 1, 2017, at 1:39 AM, Admin CampusCiti via kictanet <kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
> 
> Alex
> 
> Surgeons are finding it a lot easier to do surgery today using robots...
> 
> Ali Hussein
> Hussein & Associates
> +254 0713 601113 / 0770906375
> 
> Twitter: @AliHKassim
> Skype: abu-jomo
> LinkedIn: http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim <http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim> <http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim>
> Blog: www.alyhussein.com <http://www.alyhussein.com/>
> 
> "Discovery consists in seeing what everyone else has seen and thinking what no one else has thought".  ~ Albert Szent-Györgyi
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> On 1 Mar 2017, at 8:21 AM, awatila--- via kictanet <kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke <mailto:kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke>> wrote:
> 
>> Can a robot really take a doctors job?
>>  
>> Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for Windows 10
>>  
>> From: Mildred Achoch via kictanet <mailto:kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke>
>> Sent: Wednesday, March 1, 2017 6:53 AM
>> To: awatila at yahoo.co.uk <mailto:awatila at yahoo.co.uk>
>> Cc: Mildred Achoch <mailto:mildandred at gmail.com>
>> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Why Bill Gates would tax robots
>>  
>> In a related topic, here are the 5 jobs robots will take first: https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/5-jobs-robots-take-first-shelly-palmer?trk=eml-email_feed_ecosystem_digest_01-hero-0-null&midToken=AQFVkI2BeqJI7g&fromEmail=fromEmail&ut=1P1hcNFzkBwnE1 <https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/5-jobs-robots-take-first-shelly-palmer?trk=eml-email_feed_ecosystem_digest_01-hero-0-null&midToken=AQFVkI2BeqJI7g&fromEmail=fromEmail&ut=1P1hcNFzkBwnE1>
>> Regards,
>> Mildred Achoch.
>> 
>> Check out the Rock 'n' roll film festival, Kenya TV Channel! 
>> http://kenyarockfilmfestivaljournal.blogspot.com <http://kenyarockfilmfestivaljournal.blogspot.com/>
>> 
>>  
>> On Tue, Feb 28, 2017 at 5:14 PM, Ahmed Mohamed Maawy via kictanet <kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke <mailto:kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke>> wrote:
>> I have a couple of concerns about this specific issue:
>> Firstly, robots do not do everything a person does. That said that is why robots are "assisted" by human elements. The robots are only an extension of the human function to make it "more efficient". In most cases a robot is specialized in one specific line item duty. If they are placing a wheel on a car in the plant they don't place a wheel on a car and go on to record it in a book somewhere. They do just that. They did not go to school to learn manufacturing processes.
>> Secondly, what would be termed as a robot (without abusing the term). Is my WiFi modem a robot? Is my blender a robot? Is my car also a robot??
>> Thirdly, are robots employed or purchased? (I thought VAT on buying and maintaining robots was already a thing)
>> Not entirely for this idea for sure.
>> 
>>  
>> On Tue, Feb 28, 2017 at 5:05 PM, Admin CampusCiti via kictanet <kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke <mailto:kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke>> wrote:
>> No doubt. That we need to ensure that we hold our government to account on how they spend our taxes and wherever we can we need to chip in and help the disadvantaged. We should be our brothers' and sisters' keepers.
>> 
>> Ali Hussein
>> Hussein & Associates
>> +254 0713 601113 <tel:+254%20713%20601113> / 0770906375
>>  
>> Twitter: @AliHKassim
>> Skype: abu-jomo
>> LinkedIn: http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim <http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim>
>> Blog: www.alyhussein.com <http://www.alyhussein.com/>
>>  
>> "Discovery consists in seeing what everyone else has seen and thinking what no one else has thought".  ~ Albert Szent-Györgyi
>>  
>> Sent from my iPad
>> 
>> On 28 Feb 2017, at 4:54 PM, Mwendwa Kivuva <Kivuva at transworldafrica.com <mailto:Kivuva at transworldafrica.com>> wrote:
>> 
>> That is true Ali. Human will have to develop skills needed in this evolving society. But we should remember in every society, there still will be the F student. There will be the elderly, and most importantly, the peasants. Those with skills will prosper. But we need social nets for the disadvantaged, and those who life has served them only lemons. This category will always be there in every society 
>>  
>> On Feb 28, 2017 3:49 PM, "Admin CampusCiti" <info at campusciti.com <mailto:info at campusciti.com>> wrote:
>> We also need to consider the fact that humans need to upscale their competencies to enable us to live in this Information and data driven world. Going forward we will see more and more skilled workers stepping up to do more important work higher the value chain.
>>  
>> In the scheme of things we tend to forget this important aspect. AI, MI etc are human instigated and human will remain at the top of the food chain. 
>>  
>> Ali Hussein
>> Hussein & Associates
>> +254 0713 601113 <tel:+254%20713%20601113> / 0770906375
>>  
>> Twitter: @AliHKassim
>> Skype: abu-jomo
>> LinkedIn: http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim <http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim>
>> Blog: www.alyhussein.com <http://www.alyhussein.com/>
>>  
>> "Discovery consists in seeing what everyone else has seen and thinking what no one else has thought".  ~ Albert Szent-Györgyi
>>  
>> Sent from my iPad
>> 
>> On 28 Feb 2017, at 3:06 PM, Mwendwa Kivuva via kictanet <kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke <mailto:kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke>> wrote:
>> 
>> Your point is very good Mark Elkins.
>> 
>> I think Bill Gates is trying to simulate such a debate ... on what is
>> the role of humans in an automated, mechanized, and robotized society.
>> Traditionally, human labour has been considered as a factor of
>> production. If we declare millions of human labour redundant, and
>> there are no security measure build around it, where will humans go?
>> How will they earn their food, education, healthcare, and shelter?
>> Taxation is such a measure that build social security net around
>> humanity. So that the robots can produce, and the enterprises pay
>> government for upkeep of it's people, instead of hoarding the end
>> products of robots in vaults, and other forms of securities.
>> ______________________
>> Mwendwa Kivuva, Nairobi, Kenya
>> twitter.com/lordmwesh <http://twitter.com/lordmwesh>
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On 28 February 2017 at 15:46, Mark Elkins via kictanet
>> <kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke <mailto:kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke>> wrote:
>> 
>> I do agree though that if automation removed the jobs of existing people,
>> they should be somehow compensated - either moved to a new job internally or
>> re-trained or something positive. Usually with automation, the company can
>> be expanded (make more profit) - which should mean more human staff.  That
>> would be the ethical thing to do. I don't see this as a tax though.
>>  
>>  
>> On 28/02/2017 13:33, Mark Elkins via kictanet wrote:
>>  
>> This is probably the best reply so far!
>>  
>> Personally, a robot is a tool. This could be my coffee maker making a cup of
>> freshly ground coffee rather than a human taking the beans, grounding them
>> with stones, adding them to boiling water - etc... all by hand. Agh.
>>  
>>  
>> On 28/02/2017 11:19, awatila--- via kictanet wrote:
>>  
>> I think in the discussion the original purpose of taxation is forgotten.
>>  
>> A human being pays tax to the government to cover the cost of the common
>> services provided by the government.
>>  
>>  
>>  
>> What are this services that the robot will be consuming from the government
>> that they need to pay for?
>>  
>>  
>>  
>> Regards,
>>  
>>  
>>  
>> Alex
>>  
>>  
>>  
>>  
>>  
>> Sent from Mail for Windows 10
>>  
>>  
>>  
>> From: Mark Kipyegon via kictanet
>> Sent: Tuesday, February 28, 2017 12:06 PM
>> To: awatila at yahoo.co.uk <mailto:awatila at yahoo.co.uk>
>> Cc: Mark Kipyegon
>> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Why Bill Gates would tax robots
>>  
>>  
>>  
>> During the Industrial Revolution, critics of mechanisation would use similar
>> arguments. Advances in technology should be embraced.
>>  
>>  
>>  
>> On 28 Feb 2017, at 10:25, "kictanet-request at lists.kictanet.or.ke <mailto:kictanet-request at lists.kictanet.or.ke>"
>> <kictanet-request at lists.kictanet.or.ke <mailto:kictanet-request at lists.kictanet.or.ke>> wrote:
>>  
>>  
>>  
>>  
>>  
>> Message: 3
>>  
>> Date: Tue, 28 Feb 2017 10:21:47 +0300
>>  
>> From: Job Muriuki <muriukin at gmail.com <mailto:muriukin at gmail.com>>
>>  
>> To: Barrack Otieno <otieno.barrack at gmail.com <mailto:otieno.barrack at gmail.com>>
>>  
>> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke <mailto:kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke>>
>>  
>> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Why Bill Gates would tax robots
>>  
>> Message-ID:
>>  
>>   <CAJ+RKRbKRsadcYewDv-zEiAN0dpVKryxHye64aUc0FSB5toOkA at mail.gmail.com <mailto:CAJ+RKRbKRsadcYewDv-zEiAN0dpVKryxHye64aUc0FSB5toOkA at mail.gmail.com>>
>>  
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>>  
>>  
>>  
>> Barrack,
>>  
>>  
>>  
>> Am in business and I know it's the bottom line that counts at the expense
>>  
>> of people.
>>  
>> Now we further what to fire the already strained employee replace them
>> with
>>  
>> a robot
>>  
>> for a fatter bank account and cash you don't need.
>>  
>> I believe Bill Gates been the billionaire he is has realised you can have
>>  
>> all the cash
>>  
>> and wealth you can get but it all without meaning what really matters is
>>  
>> the humanity.
>>  
>>  
>>  
>>  
>>  
>>  
>>  
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