[kictanet] ICT Authority, not Treasury, should oversee IFMIS

[S.M. Muraya]

@Walu It should be a KICTA (not Treasury) event (hopefully in Nairobi).

How else do they prove they are an "Authority" in providing Cyber security
and transparency in Government?

SMM

*"Better a patient person than a warrior, one with self-control than one
who takes a city." Prov 16:32*

On Thu, Jan 19, 2017 at 1:15 PM, Walubengo J via kictanet <
kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:

> @Muritu,
>
> ICT Governance Framework?...spot on. The software is innocent. How you
> shape the people, processes and procedures around it so as to have checks
> and balances is what makes or breaks software.
>
> This is often quite obvious at the political level i.e Executive,
> Legislature and Judiciary relationships,  but rarely understood nor
> practiced within the ICT ecosystem. I alway recommend the COBIT framework
> <http://www.isaca.org/knowledge-center/cobit/pages/overview.aspx> for
> those keen on ICT Governance issues.
>
> COBIT - IT Governance Framework - Infor...
> <http://www.isaca.org/knowledge-center/cobit/pages/overview.aspx>
>
>
> @Muraya, organize an IFMIS forum and invite me. Would be glad to give my
> fraction of bitcoins :-)
>
> walu.
>
>
> ------------------------------
> *From:* James Muritu via kictanet <kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke>
> *To:* jwalu at yahoo.com
> *Cc:* James Muritu <james.muritu at gmail.com>
> *Sent:* Thursday, January 19, 2017 12:31 PM
>
> *Subject:* Re: [kictanet] ICT Authority, not Treasury, should oversee
> IFMIS
>
> Interesting conversations going on here. In simple terms, what IFIMIS
> lacks is a Governance Framework. The "software component" of an ERP is just
> one drop in the ocean. People+Processes+Operating Procedures+Decision
> Rights are the bigger drops. Am currently reviewing a similar system in a
> Kenya based corporation and for almost 2 years, the system had been blamed
> for all the wrong reasons. The ultimate results, revealed more loopholes
> outside the actual software.
>
> On Thu, Jan 19, 2017 at 12:01 PM, waudo siganga via kictanet <
> kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
>
> Thank Walu. I'll wait fro the coffee...
> W.
>
> On Thu, Jan 19, 2017, at 11:33 AM, Walubengo J wrote:
>
> @Daktari Siganga,
>
> I was the ICT Director for our university for 5yrs and managed both the
> University Network &  ERP - but I dont say :-)
>
> We switch between the classroom and ICT operations like that. So I kinda
> have both the academic and practical view of these things
>
> Anyway, you are right in that the IT expert(Superuser) should NOT  be a
> normal  'Finance' /'HR'/Procurement/ or other regualr user of the ERP.
> However, the IT guys still assign these roles and privileges to the various
> functional users. i.e. they must grant rights to the Finance/HR/ and other
> Directors to execute their work within the ERP.
>
> Different implementations (company policy) maybe that this is delegated to
> the various functional heads who can then subsequently grant
> privileges/access rights down through their departments.
>
> But this is NOT ideal since you lose the segregation of duties where you
> want the Functional heads(e.g. Finance Director) to make the access-rights
> requests IN WRITING, and have SOMEONE ELSE implement that request.
>
> This is the 'control' auditors are looking for when auditing the
> information system later on - in terms of checks and balances. Such a
> control is what leads to the questions like:-
> a) Who within the ERP system has privileges that were not formally
> requested for in writing? Or
> b) Who within the ERP system has more privileges than what was formally
> requested for?
> c) Who within the ERP exists but has no supporting access request from the
> Functional head?
> d) etc, etc.
>
> Even if the IT expert abused his/her superuser privileges by granting
> themselves some user rights within the Financial module, they will be outed
> by the above audit process.
>
> Denying the IT expert the ability to grant access rights within the ERP
> and passing the same to the functional heads does not solve the problem of
> abuse. The functional heads can simply become the new kingpins. Only
> segregation of duty cures the problem of abuse.
>
> But we can meet over coffee and share the pros and cons of the various
>  implementations :-)
>
> walu.
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
> From: waudo siganga <emailsignet at mailcan.com>
> To: Walubengo J <jwalu at yahoo.com>; KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <
> kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke >
> Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2017 10:36 AM
> Subject: Re: [kictanet] ICT Authority, not Treasury, should oversee IFMIS
>
> Hi Walu - I can see from your comments that you have never worked in a
> finance environment. For secure setup there is no way "IT guys must then
> translate x, y & z function into the appropriate access levels for that
> accountant within the system". Simply put a person who is a trained IT
> expert knows too much about how the system works and therefore cannot be
> assigned access administration. The overall person for access admin is a
> "super-user" or "Chief Security Officer"or a title in that direction. This
> super user assigns access rights to users, such as ability to add,delete,
> update, edit, view, etc records. To assign these rights in practically all
> IT systems the super user must himself have those same rights, otherwise
> he/she cannot assign them to other users. A system where a super-user is an
> IT expert is a very weak system. The IT expert should never have ability to
> enter a system and change records. If you analyse the IFMIS problem you
> will realise that it is not a problem of IT experts infiltrating the
> system. It is just password misuse by ordinary users. At least I agree with
> you on one thing - IT expertise role and password administration must never
> be put in the same office. In most banks and finance environments the
> super-user function is undertaken by the CEO or a very senior executive who
> is OUTSIDE the IT function.
>
> THERE IS NO PROBLEM WITH IFMIS. The users, as is normal in any IT system,
> are the weakest link. It is like having pilots who are busy with corruption
> to fly a plane then when the plane crashes we say there was a problem with
> the plane.
>
> W.
>
> On Wed, Jan 18, 2017, at 02:54 PM, Walubengo J wrote:
>
> @Dr Siganga, my comments below:
>
> >>1. Hi Walu - I do not agree with you that access administration
> (passwords) is a technical function. In most cases passwords just mimic
> authorization structures that pre-exist in a manual system.
> >>>
> Response:Yes and NO.
> Yes passwords and their access levels are controls that mimic the
> authorization levels of the manual system. However, their implementation in
> an ideal environment should be segregated.   E.g the finance director
> should say in writing: 'I need my accountant to do x, y & z function' .
> The IT guys must then translate x, y & z function into the appropriate
> access levels for that accountant within the system.
>
> Finance retains the administrative oversight in terms of triggering the
> password request and profiling the access levels desired. IT retains the
> technical function of implementing the same. Never put these two roles in
> one office. Shida mingi inajiletea.
>
> >>2. I also differ with your suggestion that it is the work of technical
> people to enforce, check or review system controls. That should be the
> function of an independent auditor.
> >>
> RESPONSE: Yes and NO.
> Yes, independent or external auditors (hopefully Information System
> Auditors) do review the  technical controls. But this is often an annual
> exercise. So serious organisation do not wait for a year to be told their
> controls were not effective. They have INTERNAL information system auditors
> (who are technical) to continuously  monitor/enforce that these IT controls
> are in place, working and/or need to be updated. Other organisation may
> allocate this role to the Information Security Officer, either way these
> are ICT technical chaps.
>
> walu.
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
> From: waudo siganga <emailsignet at mailcan.com>
> To: Walubengo J <jwalu at yahoo.com>; KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <
> kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke >
> Sent: Wednesday, January 18, 2017 1:55 PM
> Subject: Re: [kictanet] ICT Authority, not Treasury, should oversee IFMIS
>
> Hi Walu - I do not agree with you that access administration (passwords)
> is a technical function. In most cases passwords just mimic authorization
> structures that pre-exist in a manual system. It is very important that the
> access of technical people to a system, especially a financial one, be as
> inhibited as possible. Those who access the system should only be capable
> of doing the functions they would perform in a manual system. To enhance
> security of the system, access administration should be overseen by a most
> senior person who is NOT trained to do technical work on the system.
>
> I also differ with your suggestion that it is the work of technical people
> to enforce, check or review system controls. That should be the function of
> an independent auditor.
>
> Overall I think there is much misunderstanding about IFMIS. The problem is
> not technical; it is administrative. Specifically access administration
> (passwords).
>
> W.
>
> On Wed, Jan 18, 2017, at 01:06 PM, Walubengo J via kictanet wrote:
>
> Grace B via kictanet <kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke > wrote>>>
> Second, the problem with IFMIS, it appears is a lack of commitment to
> simple values such as integrity and prudent stewardship of public funds.
> What guarantee wold we have that ICTA would be different from Treasury?
>
> >>
> Segregation of duties solves this.  Treasury continues being the Process
> owner, but surrenders the Technical leadership of the system/ERP to ICT
> Authority. So if it is a case of passwords and their use, expiry amongst
> other technical issues, we know it is ICT Authority to manage (and take
> blame).
>
> It is often a confusing and thin line. The line between Administrative and
> Technical authority.
>
> But you can look at it in terms of the President's Security detail.   The
> President maybe the (Administrative) boss of his security detail, but the
> President can never tell his security detail HOW to guard him or what
> weapons to use or how many guards he needs, where to position them etc.
>
> These are TECHNICAL issues that the President cannot and should never
> pretend to be dictating on since they lie squarely within the NIS/Inspector
> General domain. The moment NIS start taking technical instructions from the
> President, is the moment our security system will collapse.
>
> If we get this seperation of authority right, we solve the IFMIS puzzle.
>
> walu.
>
>
> ------------------------------
> From: Grace B via kictanet <kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke >
> To: jwalu at yahoo.com
> Cc: Grace B <nmutungu at gmail.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, January 18, 2017 7:11 AM
> Subject: Re: [kictanet] ICT Authority, not Treasury, should oversee IFMIS
>
> Interesting discussion. There are those who would look at IFMIS as a
> public finance management issue as opposed to an ICT one but this is not
> really count when giving management mandate to either Treasury or ICTA as
> long as the objectives of PFM (Article 201 of Katiba) are met.
> One of the issues voiced about IFMIS since devolution/new Constitution has
> been the problems experienced by county governments and other independent
> organs eg commissions in accessing funds in a timely manner. (We assume
> that Executive has not had too many problems assessing funds and may have
> indeed been facilitating leakage)
> One issue with transferring the responsibility of maintaining IFMIS to
> ICTA, it seems would be that there could be few differences between ICTA
> and Treasury. First, both are Executive institutions that may support
> devolved and independent structures in line with the soft policy direction
> of the government of the day. Second, the problem with IFMIS, it appears is
> a lack of commitment to simple values such as integrity and prudent
> stewardship of public funds. What guarantee wold we have that ICTA would be
> different from Treasury?
>
> Regards
>
> 2017-01-18 5:54 GMT+03:00 Ali Hussein via kictanet <
> kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke >:
>
> Barrack
>
> We are saying the same thing really.. Let's assume that the ICTA is the
> ICT Department of the Government (which I doubt it is equipped to execute
> that mandate) then 'managing' here really means providing support to the
> system.
>
> I think it's time the Government considers the role of Chief Information
> Officer to really manage the strategic thrust of all ICT initiatives across
> ministries. The CIO can then be held accountable for overall efficiency and
> security of all Government ICT Systems. This CIO needs to report directly
> to the Chief Executive Officer (President) of the country. Now, that person
> could be seconded or be a part of the ICTA with a doted line responsibility
> to the CS, MOICT...
>
> Ultimately the overall responsibility of how well our Government ICT
> Systems work lies squarely on the CEO's desk. Look no further.
>
> Ali Hussein
> Principal
> Hussein & Associates
> +254 0713 601113
>
> Twitter: @AliHKassim
> Skype: abu-jomo
> LinkedIn: http://ke.linkedin. com/in/alihkassim
> <http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim>
> "We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, therefore, is not an act but a
> habit."  ~ Aristotle
>
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On 17 Jan 2017, at 11:27 PM, Barrack Otieno via kictanet <
> kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke > wrote:
>
>
> Hi Ali,
>
> ERP grew from MRP (Material Resource Planning which was a means of
> planning and allocating resources in Factories. The difference between
> the two is that MRP's were stand alone systems whereas ERP's are
> modular and have more functionality. From an evolution perspective ,
> it would be ideal to manage IFMIS from Ministry of Finance since they
> are the custodians of the treasury and normally allocate resources
> through the budgeting process. From a Project Management perspective,
> it would be ideal to manage IFMIS from ICTA since it is the
> specialized agency meant to manage government technology investments.
>
> Regards
>
> On 1/17/17, S.M. Muraya via kictanet <kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke >
> wrote:
>
> Doubt Treasury economists and accountants are well placed to provide Cyber
>
> Security :)
>
>
>
> We need the ICT Authority to configure enterprise wide data protection
>
> (limiting theft of passwords & access to IFMIS).
>
>
>
> In 2016, the UN ranked the UK as # 1 in providing digital services.
>
>
>
> https://publicadministration. un.org/egovkb/en-us/Reports/
> UN-E-Government-Survey-2016
> <https://publicadministration.un.org/egovkb/en-us/Reports/UN-E-Government-Survey-2016>
>
>
>
> The Government Digital Service (GDS) is part of their Cabinet Office, not
>
> their Treasury.
>
>
>
> https://www.gov.uk/government/ publications/govuk-pay/govuk- pay
> <https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/govuk-pay/govuk-pay>
>
>
>
> Their Treasury is consulted about the payment system  👆🏾  the GDS
>
> continues to build.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> SMM
>
>
>
> *"Better a patient person than a warrior, one with self-control than one
>
> who takes a city." Prov 16:32*
>
>
>
> On Tue, Jan 17, 2017 at 9:45 PM, Ali Hussein <ali at hussein.me.ke> wrote:
>
>
>
> I fundamentally disagree with this assertion.
>
>
>
> First,y, the role of a CIO is to support the enterprise. I have never
>
> heard in my life of an ERP Director. This is just adding a superfluous
>
> layer of useless bureaucracy.
>
>
>
> The owner of an ERP is the business with each department taking ownership
>
> of their components:-
>
>
>
> 1. Financials - CFO
>
> 2. CRM (Commercial/marketing/sales)
>
> 3. Procurement - Procurement which sometimes comes under Finance
>
>
>
> Etc.
>
>
>
> The CIO takes ownership to ensure that the company is well oiled to
>
> execute on its mandate. This in my humble opinion goes beyond ERPs and
>
> talks to aligning the Technology Strategy with the Business Strategy. For
>
> example in the banking sector where increasingly the more savvy banks are
>
> taking a 'Platform Thinking' approach. This allows partners to plug into
>
> their core technology through APIs to enable them extend capabilities and
>
> hence offerings to their customers.
>
>
>
> The role of a CIO has fundamentally changed to speak to the need for
>
> using
>
> Technology as an accelerator to successful business models.
>
>
>
> Secondly, I don't see how the ICT Authority would be better in managing
>
> the monster that is IFMIS. Let them first learn the basics of
>
> communicating
>
> effectively with the community before taking on this elephant in the
>
> room.
>
>
>
> *Ali Hussein*
>
> *Principal*
>
> *Hussein & Associates*
>
> +254 0713 601113
>
>
>
> Twitter: @AliHKassim
>
>
>
> Skype: abu-jomo
>
>
>
> LinkedIn: http://ke.linkedin.com/in/ alihkassim
> <http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim>
>
>
>
> "We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, therefore, is not an act but a
>
> habit."  ~ Aristotle
>
>
>
>
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>
>
> On 17 Jan 2017, at 6:42 PM, S.M. Muraya via kictanet <
>
> kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
>
>
>
> Interesting comments...
>
>
>
> ICT Authority, not Treasury, should oversee IFMIS
>
>
>
> http://www.nation.co.ke/oped/ blogs/dot9/walubengo/2274560-
> <http://www.nation.co.ke/oped/blogs/dot9/walubengo/2274560->
>
> 3520560-5j04aq/index.html
>
>
>
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> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform
> for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and
> regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT
> sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
>
> KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors
> online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth,
> share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do
> not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
>
>
>
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> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform
> for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and
> regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT
> sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
>
> KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors
> online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth,
> share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do
> not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
>
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