[kictanet] Brazilians Locked out of WhatsApp

Thu Dec 17 23:33:40 EAT 2015

Ebele and Moses,

I think we are speaking on the same script here, only different arrangement
of thoughts.

There is no country that is free from violating the rights and freedoms of
human rights defenders. Even the most progressive countries. Snowden and
Assange quickly comes to mind. But I don't remember a US company refusing
data request from a court of competent jurisdiction (Read a US court). The
company can go through all appeal mechanisms but when final ruling is made,
they usually accent to the ruling. There are exceptions like Lavabit which
opted to fold it's operations than hand over information the clients had
entrusted it with. I also remember when Blackberry was placed between a
rock and a hard place during the 2011 England riots, Research in Motion
assisted British police in tracking rioters who used BBM, stating, "We
comply with the Regulation of Investigatory Powers Act and co-operate fully
with the Home Office and UK police forces."

There is a series of reports that CIPESA has authored, with collaboration
with partners like Kictanet that shows data requests from African countries
to the Silicon valley blue chips. As far as I know, non was ever accented
to. Moses, I'm generalising "silicon valley" because that is where most of
the big boys come from. Of course Sype is owned by the guys at Redmond, and
Blackberry from Ontario...

You see here, the companies have to act with public interest in mind.
Developing countries are frowned-at the many times their courts have asked
for such data. Many of these countries are repressive regimes, and I don't
necessarily support such requests. How do we handle such requests? I submit
that the best option is to have international treaties on the same, but
governments should not be left to their own devices. Some countries I
cannot mention here are just terrible with their human rights records.

Lets get something clear, I'm for protection of human rights defenders. And
I'm for end to end encryption. Like what Lets Encrtpt is trying to achieve.
I'm also for default encryption like what Google is doing with the new
version of Android.

My argument are based on the Manilla Principles on Intermediary liabilities
spearheaded by Electronic Frontier Foundation and where Kictanet was part
of the drafting team. If I'm not wrong, we said that all data requests
should come with a court order. By the way EFF is one of the most prominent
civil society organisations that are true to their word in protecting human
rights and taking governments by the horn.

This reminds me, just like Net Neutrality, Kenya does not have any
meaningful legislation on Intermediary liabilities.

Leo nimemwaga kizungu yangu yote. With all that good writing from Moses and
Ebele. :-)
On Dec 17, 2015 8:08 PM, "Ebele Okobi" <ebeleokobi at fb.com> wrote:

> This statement is a bit under-informed. I am at Facebook now, but I was
> previously at Yahoo, where I led the business & human rights program,
> explicitly focused on ensuring that Yahoo¹s engagement with law
> enforcement was governed by human rights principles-the only organization
> of its kind. Companies like Yahoo, Facebook, Google subject requests from
> US law enforcement to rigorous assessments requiring that those requests
> are lawful and do not violate human rights. Companies also regularly push
> back on US law enforcement requests when the requests are not valid or
> over-broad.
>
> This information can be easily gleaned from transparency reports, which
> all major tech companies publish. Most significantly, Yahoo also took the
> NSA to court, the only company to ever do so, explicitly because Yahoo
> refused to hand over user data. While that was the most serious case, in
> that it was a national security case, tech companies are constantly going
> to court in the US to preserve users rights to privacy.  Now, from a legal
> perspective, the fact that a company is domiciled in a country, and the
> fact that the country has legal jurisdiction necessarily, from a legal
> perspective, means that the country has more authority over a company.
> That is just a matter of law, in the same way that, say, Safaricom is
> subject to far greater restrictions in Kenya.
>
> Now, there is a very interesting conversation to be had about how to make
> global law enforcement requests work in a borderless context, and that¹s
> why Facebook and other tech companies are part of a working group to
> identify how to pilot a mechanism that both respects international human
> rights norms (not an easy thing, at all, by the way) and doesn¹t make our
> companies involuntary police, and that keeps people as safe as possible on
> line.
>
>
> Links with more information-
> http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/sep/11/yahoo-nsa-lawsuit-documents-fi
> ne-user-data-refusal
> http://news.yahoo.com/judge-orders-google-hand-over-personal-user-data-1825
> 26071.html
> https://transparency.yahoo.com/users-first/index.htm
> https://www.google.com/transparencyreport/userdatarequests/US/
> https://govtrequests.facebook.com/country/United%20States/2015-H1/
> https://www.dropbox.com/transparency/?_tk=mb&_camp=news&_ad=transparency-h1
> -2015&_net=transparency
>
>
>
>
> Ebele
> Okobi | Head of Public Policy, Africa
> m. +44 (0) 771
> 156 1315
> 2 Stephen St | London | W1T 1AN
>
> ebeleokobi at fb.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On 12/17/15, 1:33 PM, "kictanet on behalf of Mwendwa Kivuva via kictanet"
> <kictanet-bounces+ebeleokobi=fb.com at lists.kictanet.or.ke on behalf of
> kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
>
> >With all respect, have you ever seen how the Silicon Valley companies
> >treat other countries with contempt especially when it comes to data
> >requests? But when Uncle Sam asks for the information, they are given.
> >
> >Therefore this debate should be more about finding a balance between
> >privacy and the rule of law. This also falls under the broader cross
> >border communication debate that has been raging especially in EU
> >region and Russia. It's a tough nut I admit.
> >
> >On 17/12/2015, Barrack Otieno via kictanet
> ><kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
> >> Great discussion,
> >>
> >> Would be interesting to get the Communications Authority position on the
> >> same in light of recent statements issued by CBK on bit coins :-)
> >>
> >> Regards
> >> On Dec 17, 2015 3:04 PM, "Ebele Okobi via kictanet" <
> >> kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
> >>
> >>> Of course-got it!
> >>> I was focusing on the privacy issue, not the operator revenue issue. I
> >>>do
> >>> think it's interesting to think of the fact that operators themselves
> >>> were
> >>> disrupters. . .
> >>>
> >>> Ebele Okobi | Head of Public Policy, Africa
> >>>
> >>> m. +44 (0) 771 156 1315 <+44%20(0)%20771%20156%201315>
> >>>
> >>> 10 Brock Street | London | NW1 3FG
> >>>
> >>> ebeleokobi at fb.com
> >>>
> >>> [image: 6F376569-CC77-422B-BAD3-794055B1E02B]
> >>>
> >>> On Dec 17, 2015, at 11:48 AM, Mose Karanja <mosekaranja at gmail.com>
> >>>wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Uber disrupted the taxi ecosystem so immensely that some taxi unions
> >>> started attacks on Uber the company and Uber the product arguing they
> >>>are
> >>> taxed and licensed yet their new competitors are not taxed. They
> >>>hope(d)
> >>> the regulators would side with their argument. Some did some didn't.
> >>>
> >>> The Uber-moment is thus (in my world) that point in the life of a
> >>> disruptive product when the existing dominant player seeks favor from
> >>>the
> >>> regulators to block that which 'they can't understand'.
> >>>
> >>> Cue in Bob Dylan's Times are A Changing :)
> >>> On 17 Dec 2015 13:31, "Paul Roy" <roykoikai at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Ebele,
> >>>>
> >>>> This is going to open a whole set of regulatory concerns around
> >>>>privacy
> >>>> vs. security.
> >>>>
> >>>> Following this keenly!
> >>>>
> >>>> Paul Roy.
> >>>>
> >>>> On Thu, Dec 17, 2015 at 12:55 PM, Ebele Okobi via kictanet <
> >>>> kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>> Uber moment? Tell me more!
> >>>>>
> >>>>> WhatsApp is protecting the privacy rights of its users-here's a FB
> >>>>>post
> >>>>> from WhatsApp's founder, Jan Koum (btw, when you get a chance, look
> >>>>>up
> >>>>> his
> >>>>> personal history. It gives a sense of why he is so passionate about
> >>>>>the
> >>>>> right to privacy.)
> >>>>>
> >>>>> "We are disappointed in the short-sighted decision to cut off access
> >>>>>to
> >>>>> WhatsApp, a communication tool that so many Brazilians have come to
> >>>>> depend
> >>>>> on, and sad to see Brazil isolate itself from the rest of the world."
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Ebele Okobi | Head of Public Policy, Africa
> >>>>>
> >>>>> m. +44 (0) 771 156 1315 <+44%20(0)%20771%20156%201315>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> 10 Brock Street | London | NW1 3FG
> >>>>>
> >>>>> ebeleokobi at fb.com
> >>>>>
> >>>>> [image: 6F376569-CC77-422B-BAD3-794055B1E02B]
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On Dec 17, 2015, at 9:42 AM, Mose Karanja via kictanet <
> >>>>> kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> A Brazilian judge has ordered a 48 hour WhatsApp lockdown.
> >>>>> The order claims WhatsApp refused to cooperate with Law Enforcement
> >>>>> agencies on data handover.
> >>>>> The harshness of the verdict is thus seen as a retaliation to show
> >>>>> whois
> >>>>> boss.
> >>>>> However, there is the Telco Lobby pushing for regulation (that word
> >>>>> again) of VOIP (WhatsApp calls) under the claim that Brazilians are
> >>>>>no
> >>>>> longer using voice calls and yet they are taxed for the spectrum
> >>>>>which
> >>>>> WhatsApp is not being taxed for since it is not classified as a
> >>>>>Telco.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> You can read more here (in Portuguese):
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www1.folha.uol.com
> >>>>>.br_mercado_2015_12_1719934-2Djustica-2Ddetermina-2Dbloqueio-2Ddo-2Dwh
> >>>>>atsapp-2Dem-2Dtodo-2Dbrasil-2Dpor-2D48-2Dhoras.shtml&d=CwICAg&c=5VD0RT
> >>>>>tNlTh3ycd41b3MUw&r=ArvepG4_wcNu_X9xi3nb_Xa9WsGLVfmK6mwPdVONOTE&m=6UZKq
> >>>>>8H6KDrVTaOQh_0kOsuMCWlU7MmaDt-7yL2JSR4&s=k1ZaIYHa7b4nQsE97V-mdP9uj1l9T
> >>>>>0oPVR0EpAR1F3s&e=
> >>>>>
> >>>>><
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www1.folha.uol.co
> >>>>>m.br_mercado_2015_12_1719934-2Djustica-2Ddetermina-2Dbloqueio-2Ddo-2Dw
> >>>>>hatsapp-2Dem-2Dtodo-2Dbrasil-2Dpor-2D48-2Dhoras.shtml&d=CwMFaQ&c=5VD0R
> >>>>>TtNlTh3ycd41b3MUw&r=ArvepG4_wcNu_X9xi3nb_Xa9WsGLVfmK6mwPdVONOTE&m=Mvsu
> >>>>>ZVjTPjBi_OMkstBjZebmwW2P9xrTdd1VIdrRapo&s=OnNDfBrAmo3aYDs7JvN9XOyiRKbB
> >>>>>tv7bCuSHwJOFACk&e=>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> or here in English
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__techcrunch.com_201
> >>>>>5_12_16_brazils-2Dcongress-2Dhas-2Dshut-2Ddown-2Dwhatsapp-2Dtonight-2D
> >>>>>and-2Dthe-2Drest-2Dof-2Dthe-2Dsocial-2Dweb-2Dcould-2Dbe-2Dnext_-3Fncid
> >>>>>-3Drss-26utm-5Fsource-3Dfeedburner-26utm-5Fmedium-3Dfeed-26utm-5Fcampa
> >>>>>ign-3DFeed-253A-2BTechcrunch-2B-2528TechCrunch-2529-26utm-5Fcontent-3D
> >>>>>FaceBook-26sr-5Fshare-3Dfacebook&d=CwICAg&c=5VD0RTtNlTh3ycd41b3MUw&r=A
> >>>>>rvepG4_wcNu_X9xi3nb_Xa9WsGLVfmK6mwPdVONOTE&m=6UZKq8H6KDrVTaOQh_0kOsuMC
> >>>>>WlU7MmaDt-7yL2JSR4&s=zsGZfCg07SsZpvbxy8rVVY_1mKzcyDFPGaHKtK-RVFI&e=
> >>>>>
> >>>>><
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__techcrunch.com_20
> >>>>>15_12_16_brazils-2Dcongress-2Dhas-2Dshut-2Ddown-2Dwhatsapp-2Dtonight-2
> >>>>>Dand-2Dthe-2Drest-2Dof-2Dthe-2Dsocial-2Dweb-2Dcould-2Dbe-2Dnext_-3Fnci
> >>>>>d-3Drss-26utm-5Fsource-3Dfeedburner-26utm-5Fmedium-3Dfeed-26utm-5Fcamp
> >>>>>aign-3DFeed-3A-2BTechcrunch-2B-28TechCrunch-29-26utm-5Fcontent-3DFaceB
> >>>>>ook-26sr-5Fshare-3Dfacebook&d=CwMFaQ&c=5VD0RTtNlTh3ycd41b3MUw&r=ArvepG
> >>>>>4_wcNu_X9xi3nb_Xa9WsGLVfmK6mwPdVONOTE&m=MvsuZVjTPjBi_OMkstBjZebmwW2P9x
> >>>>>rTdd1VIdrRapo&s=zPUHNKuMHDnEiDYedr_bvXqCA2c6fw_35PpqcK_4riI&e=>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> An Uber-moment for WhatsApp.
> >>>>> ---
> >>>>> Moses Karanja | @Mose_Karanja
> >>>>>
> >>>>><
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__twitter.com_Mose
> >>>>>-5FKaranja&d=CwMFaQ&c=5VD0RTtNlTh3ycd41b3MUw&r=ArvepG4_wcNu_X9xi3nb_Xa
> >>>>>9WsGLVfmK6mwPdVONOTE&m=MvsuZVjTPjBi_OMkstBjZebmwW2P9xrTdd1VIdrRapo&s=T
> >>>>>FUayDnKWSQiLJ5A5taBBVg68OqLz-jB-sZLewQkGk4&e=>
> >>>>>  | PGP: 0x1529552F
> >>>>>
> >>>>><
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__pgp.mit.edu_pks_
> >>>>>lookup-3Fop-3Dindex-26fingerprint-3Don-26search-3D0x1529552F&d=CwMFaQ&
> >>>>>c=5VD0RTtNlTh3ycd41b3MUw&r=ArvepG4_wcNu_X9xi3nb_Xa9WsGLVfmK6mwPdVONOTE
> >>>>>&m=MvsuZVjTPjBi_OMkstBjZebmwW2P9xrTdd1VIdrRapo&s=o-aNMXG-3V1LbyMmFBOLe
> >>>>>bwzphVqejbK3fQZiyIeVeE&e=>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> _______________________________________________
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> >>>>>
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> >>>>>.ke_mailman_listinfo_kictanet&d=CwICAg&c=5VD0RTtNlTh3ycd41b3MUw&r=Arve
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> >>>>>7MmaDt-7yL2JSR4&s=sDffn3X_ttfeJbPwwBNVa_UGJg1r-QOXVbaZqZyu6zo&e=
> >>>>>
> >>>>><
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__lists.kictanet.o
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> >>>>>P9xrTdd1VIdrRapo&s=fbEaBugqOJdceu29KdI4T4qHVQKNFIIP6oUg_WdmI0o&e=>
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> >>>>> Unsubscribe or change your options at
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> >>>>>lTh3ycd41b3MUw&r=ArvepG4_wcNu_X9xi3nb_Xa9WsGLVfmK6mwPdVONOTE&m=6UZKq8H
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> >>>>>
> >>>>><
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__lists.kictanet.o
> >>>>>r.ke_mailman_options_kictanet_ebeleokobi-2540fb.com
> &d=CwMFaQ&c=5VD0RTt
> >>>>>NlTh3ycd41b3MUw&r=ArvepG4_wcNu_X9xi3nb_Xa9WsGLVfmK6mwPdVONOTE&m=MvsuZV
> >>>>>jTPjBi_OMkstBjZebmwW2P9xrTdd1VIdrRapo&s=vd2srCED3auO3LqOWReD7KwZph_GgD
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> >>>>>
> >>>>> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder
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> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__lists.kictanet.o
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> >>>>>tNlTh3ycd41b3MUw&r=ArvepG4_wcNu_X9xi3nb_Xa9WsGLVfmK6mwPdVONOTE&m=6UZKq
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> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__lists.kictanet.o
> >>>>>r.ke_mailman_options_kictanet_roykoikai-2540gmail.com
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> >>>>>TtNlTh3ycd41b3MUw&r=ArvepG4_wcNu_X9xi3nb_Xa9WsGLVfmK6mwPdVONOTE&m=Mvsu
> >>>>>ZVjTPjBi_OMkstBjZebmwW2P9xrTdd1VIdrRapo&s=FNOnOAiZmoOvPU9Lag6YJfOw55Hu
> >>>>>Ne2gUUnPAaN9Zw0&e=>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder
> >>>>>platform
> >>>>> for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and
> >>>>> regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the
> >>>>>ICT
> >>>>> sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and
> >>>>> development.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable
> >>>>>behaviors
> >>>>> online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and
> >>>>> bandwidth,
> >>>>> share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect
> >>>>>privacy,
> >>>>> do
> >>>>> not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> --
> >>>> "Change is slow and gradual. It requires hardwork, a bit of
> >>>> luck, a fair amount of self-sacrifice and a lot of patience."
> >>>>
> >>>> Roy.
> >>>>
> >>>
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> >>>e_mailman_listinfo_kictanet&d=CwICAg&c=5VD0RTtNlTh3ycd41b3MUw&r=ArvepG4_
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> >>>H6KDrVTaOQh_0kOsuMCWlU7MmaDt-7yL2JSR4&s=tC9YhWW-lCsI8bX8V_m-fE5aNldSBlbQ
> >>>N8ms_2D_HQM&e=
> >>>
> >>> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform
> >>> for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and
> >>> regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT
> >>> sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and
> >>> development.
> >>>
> >>> KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors
> >>> online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and
> >>> bandwidth,
> >>> share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy,
> >>>do
> >>> not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
> >>>
> >>
> >
> >
> >--
> >______________________
> >Mwendwa Kivuva, Nairobi, Kenya
> >twitter.com/lordmwesh
> >
> >The best athletes never started as the best athletes.
> >"You miss 100 percent of the shots you never take." - Wayne Gretzky.
> >I will persist until I succeed - Og Mandino.
> >
> >_______________________________________________
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