[kictanet] Vodafone admits that some governments have a direct link to their network for snooping

Sun Jun 8 13:46:24 EAT 2014

And after investing all their energy into war, how are the two doing? Let's
not get distracted, border security and well run police and army can tackle
our issues.

Let's not spend lots of resources covering for incompetency, it won't work.
On 8 Jun 2014 13:25, "S.M. Muraya" <murigi.muraya at gmail.com> wrote:

> Maybe the country we live in borders Somalia and Sudan :-|
> On Jun 8, 2014 1:12 PM, "Dennis Kioko via kictanet" <
> kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
>
>> Of what value are wars and militarisation to a country?
>>
>> Does it add more ugali to our table?
>>
>> Sweden and Japan have toned down on their military aggression to focus on
>> their economy.
>>
>> Switzerland voted in a referendum to determine if the state should buy
>> military jets.
>>
>> What's with African countries, militarism and the urge to maintain
>> secrecy in security projects?
>>  On 8 Jun 2014 10:04, "Ali Hussein via kictanet" <
>> kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
>>
>>> Ngigi
>>>
>>> There is a fundamental issue here in question. Is the government working
>>> at cross-purposes with itself?
>>>
>>> *Ali Hussein*
>>>
>>> +254 770 906375 / 0713 601113
>>>
>>> Twitter: @AliHKassim
>>>
>>> Skype: abu-jomo
>>>
>>> LinkedIn: http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim
>>> <http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim>
>>>
>>> Blog: www.alyhussein.com
>>>
>>> "I fear the day technology will surpass human interaction. The world
>>> will have a generation of idiots".  ~ Albert Einstein
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>
>>> On Jun 7, 2014, at 6:29 PM, Ngigi Waithaka <ngigi at at.co.ke> wrote:
>>>
>>> Ali,
>>>
>>> I understand Secrecy, but if something is secret enough that you can't
>>> even trust your own AG, then its 100% bound to be criminal!
>>>
>>> And if you look at how the US procures and builds secret networks and
>>> technologies, they will have restricted tenders to say Boeing, Lockheed,
>>> GE, Airbus et.al and most often than not, the first phase tends to be a
>>> paid-for PoC from the various vendors, then a selection is made based on a
>>> set criteria.
>>>
>>> If time is of the essence and for other factors including *secrecy*,
>>> then you can actually single-source, but even in such a case there are
>>> certain procedures to be followed.
>>>
>>> I can't for once imagine in any of these negotiations leaving the AG
>>> Office out of it. That *stinks* to high heavens...
>>>
>>> When I heard of this the first time, I was actually very pro it, but as
>>> these details emerge, then it quickly becomes very clear where this is
>>> heading...
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sat, Jun 7, 2014 at 4:50 PM, Ali Hussein <ali at hussein.me.ke> wrote:
>>>
>>>> :)
>>>>
>>>> Ngigi, my thoughts exactly. However, I think some of these things need
>>>> to go into the preserve of NIS as part of their budget. Imagine if the US
>>>> Govt (read CIA et al) announced that they are building a super secret
>>>> network to curb terrorism...Where is the secrecy then?
>>>>
>>>> Just saying..
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> *Ali Hussein*
>>>>
>>>> +254 770 906375 / 0713 601113
>>>>
>>>> Twitter: @AliHKassim
>>>>
>>>> Skype: abu-jomo
>>>>
>>>> LinkedIn: http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim
>>>> <http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim>
>>>>
>>>> Blog: www.alyhussein.com
>>>>
>>>> "I fear the day technology will surpass human interaction. The world
>>>> will have a generation of idiots".  ~ Albert Einstein
>>>>
>>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>>
>>>> On Jun 7, 2014, at 4:29 PM, Ngigi Waithaka <ngigi at at.co.ke> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> There is also something which is not clear on the proposed Network, is
>>>> it an Intelligence Network, Law Enforcement Network or both? Normally
>>>> Intelligence would have a lot more sway as the last thing we would want is
>>>> to wake up and find Al-Shabaab Tanks right in the middle of town.
>>>>
>>>> Then, the other side of the coin rears its ugly side once again.... The
>>>> AG says he was never consulted in drafting this deal (
>>>> http://www.standardmedia.co.ke/mobile/?articleID=2000123884&story_title=my-advice-was-not-sought-says-ag
>>>> ).
>>>>
>>>> Picture this, you are about to strike a Ksh 15B deal and you don't
>>>> consult your Lawyer? Is that not what you would want to do as the first
>>>> thing?
>>>>
>>>> "...And so the wise men sat together, came up with a wise plan to have
>>>> a security network and an even smarter plan that the country will not have
>>>> to pay anything for now as the single-sourced contractor will finance the
>>>> whole project and for good measure, keep the Governments Legal adviser at
>>>> bay...."
>>>>
>>>> Seriously, I would have thought Anura Pereira had a copyright on this
>>>> scheme?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Sat, Jun 7, 2014 at 1:11 PM, Ali Hussein <ali at hussein.me.ke> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Ngigi
>>>>>
>>>>> I like your thinking and the paradigm you have brought forth.
>>>>>
>>>>> My real sense of all this is that we are taking this transparency
>>>>> thing too far. If the govt really needs to build this network to safeguard
>>>>> our borders we need to rethink how the rules of engagement are going to be
>>>>> going forward.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> *Ali Hussein*
>>>>>
>>>>> +254 770 906375 / 0713 601113
>>>>>
>>>>> Twitter: @AliHKassim
>>>>>
>>>>> Skype: abu-jomo
>>>>>
>>>>> LinkedIn: http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim
>>>>> <http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim>
>>>>>
>>>>> Blog: www.alyhussein.com
>>>>>
>>>>> "I fear the day technology will surpass human interaction. The world
>>>>> will have a generation of idiots".  ~ Albert Einstein
>>>>>
>>>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>>>
>>>>> On Jun 6, 2014, at 2:47 PM, Ngigi Waithaka <ngigi at at.co.ke> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Ali,
>>>>>
>>>>> This is the way I see it:
>>>>> 1. It's almost a forgone conclusion that Governments will listen in on
>>>>> communications between citizens; if the NSA could collect Americans private
>>>>> communications without court-orders and this with all the Bills of Rights
>>>>> in place, then what chance do other countries & Angela Merkel have?
>>>>>
>>>>> 2.What worries me more about the Vodafones of this world is that,
>>>>> their primary allegiance is not to the countries where they do business,
>>>>> but to their motherland, UK. Who would like to bet whether #G#H#C#Q#
>>>>> listens in on private communications from the Safaricom/Vodafone Network?
>>>>> Every Government Officials communication including our President's is fair
>>>>> game.
>>>>>
>>>>> 3. If then we contract the same Safaricom/Vodafone to build for us a
>>>>> 'Secure' Communications Network, you can bet that every router, switch, and
>>>>> Server that will be deployed with have pre-built backdoors just in-case
>>>>> they will need to be used in the future.
>>>>>
>>>>> So, if indeed we know all the above, why go ahead and contract
>>>>> Safaricom/Vodafone to build our security network? Is it the lesser evil?
>>>>>
>>>>> 4. One of the reasons cited by GoK to single-source with Safaricom is
>>>>> that it is the only organization that is affliated to GoK that can do this.
>>>>> Which is exactly not true as I believe we do have a pretty significant
>>>>> shareholding in Orange and there is nothing as good as a competing offer to
>>>>> get you best value.
>>>>>
>>>>> And a different angle to this, does our police really need an
>>>>> independent network (which also happens to be the bulk of the Ksh 15B that
>>>>> we'll be paying for?). Instead of building a single network and putting all
>>>>> our anti-terrorism 'eggs' in it, would it not have been more prudent and
>>>>> less expensive to use the already existing networks but with an added
>>>>> security layer and achieve the exact same result?
>>>>>
>>>>> Rent the networks from anyone who has capacity (Safaricom, Orange, Yu
>>>>> etc) build your layer on top and you don't have to worry about 4G, 5G,
>>>>> 6G... As they upgrade, you upgrade.
>>>>>
>>>>> Regards
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Fri, Jun 6, 2014 at 12:46 PM, Ali Hussein via kictanet <
>>>>> kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Listers
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In view of the debate about the security tender awarded to Safaricom
>>>>>> and now in contention within the parliamentary committee responsible for
>>>>>> this its incumbent upon all of us in the industry that we understand this
>>>>>> issue deeper.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> See below:-
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://www.businessinsider.com/r-vodafone-says-governments-have-direct-access-to-eavesdrop-in-some-countries-2014-06
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm also curious to know what the TOR for this tender was. I'm all
>>>>>> open to the government securing our borders against our enemies but we also
>>>>>> must know what these parameters of 'snooping' are.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *Ali Hussein*
>>>>>>
>>>>>> +254 770 906375 / 0713 601113
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Twitter: @AliHKassim
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Skype: abu-jomo
>>>>>>
>>>>>> LinkedIn: http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim
>>>>>> <http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Blog: www.alyhussein.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "I fear the day technology will surpass human interaction. The world
>>>>>> will have a generation of idiots".  ~ Albert Einstein
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>
>>>>>> Unsubscribe or change your options at
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>>>>>>
>>>>>> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder
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>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> *Regards,*
>>>>>
>>>>> *Wait**haka Ngigi*
>>>>> Chief Executive Officer | Alliance Technologies | MCK Nairobi Synod
>>>>> Building
>>>>> T + 254 (0) 20 2333 471 |Office Mobile: +254 786 28 28 28 | M + 254
>>>>> 737 811 000
>>>>> www.at.co.ke
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> *Regards,*
>>>>
>>>> *Wait**haka Ngigi*
>>>> Chief Executive Officer | Alliance Technologies | MCK Nairobi Synod
>>>> Building
>>>> T + 254 (0) 20 2333 471 |Office Mobile: +254 786 28 28 28 | M + 254
>>>> 737 811 000
>>>> www.at.co.ke
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> *Regards,*
>>>
>>> *Wait**haka Ngigi*
>>> Chief Executive Officer | Alliance Technologies | MCK Nairobi Synod
>>> Building
>>> T + 254 (0) 20 2333 471 |Office Mobile: +254 786 28 28 28 | M + 254 737
>>> 811 000
>>> www.at.co.ke
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>>
>>> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform
>>> for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and
>>> regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT
>>> sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
>>>
>>> KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors
>>> online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth,
>>> share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do
>>> not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
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>>
>> Unsubscribe or change your options at
>> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/murigi.muraya%40gmail.com
>>
>> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform
>> for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and
>> regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT
>> sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
>>
>> KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors
>> online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth,
>> share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do
>> not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
>>
>
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