[kictanet] PSVs required to fit cameras, implement cashless payment, and fleet management systems
Ngigi Waithaka
ngigi at at.co.ke
Tue Jan 7 10:24:35 EAT 2014
Ali,
This is our 'leadership curse'. A key person walks to Dubai, sees a well
oiled transport system using electronic tickets and in short-order a
declaration is made that in so many months, our transport system will be
digitized and cashless.
What we fail to look at is what needs to be done in between to get the
results we want. What we call Product Development (
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_product_development ) in Software
We just want results!
On an aside, do you guys think that a 5-year election cycle is long enough
to achieve realistic growth. I sometime do feel that, between the time a
new government checks in and the time between when they stop thinking
development and start thinking elections again is too short. For us, that's
around 2.5yrs
Regards
On Tue, Jan 7, 2014 at 5:32 AM, Ali Hussein <ali at hussein.me.ke> wrote:
> Listers
>
> Lost in all this discussion about safety and payment systems in public
> transport is that:-
>
> 1. Any country worth its salt and geared for growth prioritizes public
> transport as a critical resource for growth.
>
> 2. In most of the 'developed' world public transport is not left entirely
> to the vagaries of private enterprise. These are concessions that are
> tendered out every 5-10 years and the winner(s) of the concession is
> subject to clear QoS standards and fares are preset by both the Govt and
> the concessionaire. The UK has done this pretty successfully.
>
> 3. A look at Dubai will tell you that the RTA (Road Transport Authority)
> owns and manages the Metro, the Taxis and the buses which have an
> interoperable payment system. And the system works like a well oiled
> machine.
>
> The million dollar question is whether we have the political will to
> overhaul our mass transport systems.
>
> Over the holidays my sister and her kids insisted they wanted to go to
> Mombasa via train. I asked them severally if they were sure about this.
> After an argument of pros and cons we finally bought them tickets and they
> embarked on their 'adventure'. A number of things stood out for me:-
>
> 1. The road leading to the train station could be categorized more as the
> surface of the moon than a road.
> 2. The train station is like it is in a time capsule circa 1985 when I
> used to go via train from Mombasa to Nairobi to boarding school. I swear to
> God that the station has not improved one bit. It's like it was when the
> British built it!!
> 3. Lastly it took my family 24 hours (yes 24 hours!!) to reach Mombasa
> when it took me about 11 hours in 1985!!
>
> I'm not saying that this talk about payment systems and interoperability
> isn't progress but..
>
> Are we putting the cart before the horse?? Are we band aiding a cancer
> when what we need is chemotherapy?
>
> Just saying..
>
> Ali Hussein
>
> +254 0770 906375 / 0713 601113
>
> "I fear the day technology will surpass human interaction. The world will
> have a generation of idiots". ~ Albert Einstein
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On Jan 6, 2014, at 9:14 PM, Baiju Shah <baiju at tele2media.com> wrote:
>
> Hi All,
>
> Very interesting discussion on new policy, in fact the government should
> consider the implementation of a single standard for payments like ITSO in
> the UK to provide interoperability between different modes of transport.
> e.g. If I use the train, matatu to get to work I should be able to buy or
> load a ticket on to a card, mobile phone or any other, which could be
> easily accepted by the different modes of transport operators.
>
> This will also enable some amount of regulation and discipline within the
> modal transport operators who could be measured on quality of service. This
> could also include behaviour on the road. Simple matrix could be developed,
> to provide the quality of transport that is available in many cities around
> the world. This also is away to ensure that the government is able to
> assure safety, in return be able to collect taxes to improve facilities for
> the commuters that could include footpaths and proper rest areas etc.
>
> Furthermore, not too sure of the fleet management aspect of the policy as
> this is something that individual companies can choose to implement, is
> open to manipulation, this will not guarantee that the different companies
> are meeting their stated KPI's, and there is no way you can penalise the
> PSV it could be too late, additionally, all PSV drivers need to retest and
> get issued with proper driving licences that are not subject to fraud as a
> part of the regulation of the sector.
>
> There are many points that could be discussed, the important point is
> there is action being taken and if there is help required in thinking
> through the various policies and if it is going to make the daily commute
> easy we are here to help and advice.
>
> Thanks
>
> Best Regards,
> Baiju Shah
> Telemedia Africa Ltd
> Tel. 0787332247 / 0701691570
>
> On 5 Jan 2014, at 19:29, kictanet-request at lists.kictanet.or.ke wrote:
>
>
> Send kictanet mailing list submissions to
>
> kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke
>
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>
> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
>
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>
> kictanet-request at lists.kictanet.or.ke
>
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
>
> kictanet-owner at lists.kictanet.or.ke
>
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>
> than "Re: Contents of kictanet digest..."
>
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>
> 1. Re: PSVs required to fit cameras, implement cashless payment,
>
> and fleet management systems (Mark Mwangi)
>
> 2. Re: PSVs required to fit cameras, implement cashless payment,
>
> and fleet management systems (Watila Alex)
>
> 3. Re: PSVs required to fit cameras, implement cashless payment,
>
> and fleet management systems (kris njoroge)
>
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> Message: 1
>
> Date: Sun, 5 Jan 2014 17:58:02 +0300
>
> From: Mark Mwangi <mwangy at gmail.com>
>
> To: Ngigi Waithaka <ngigi at at.co.ke>
>
> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke>
>
> Subject: Re: [kictanet] PSVs required to fit cameras, implement
>
> cashless payment, and fleet management systems
>
> Message-ID:
>
> <CAH5fjchpP=MpWeZHUEu1_q35_dpvCse9r5P4icuWPVHE-9uGsw at mail.gmail.com>
>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
>
> I agree with the scheduling bit though i don't see how this can be divorced
>
> from the fares. I still insist transport should be primarily a govt affair.
>
> If not by ownership then by strict regulation inclusive of setting of
>
> fares, just like in Energy. if let loose we have the likes of Enron and our
>
> matatu culture as is. Some sectors cannot be left to market forces because
>
> market forces are largely an idyllic situation and manipulated to the core.
>
>
>
>
> On Sun, Jan 5, 2014 at 2:15 PM, Ngigi Waithaka <ngigi at at.co.ke> wrote:
>
>
> Digital Speed Governors aka Tachographs are a good idea.
>
>
> We could start with that, get matatus on regular timed schedules, then
>
> start selling electronic tickets for day, week & month, yearly. This you
>
> pay for using Mpesa etc, but spot fares should be in cash.
>
>
> Waithaka Ngigi
>
>
> Alliance Technologies
>
> Nairobi, Kenya
>
>
> www.A1.io
>
> On 5 Jan 2014 13:21, "Kivuva" <Kivuva at transworldafrica.com> wrote:
>
>
> A new law to regulate the public transport has been put in place and
>
> will take effect by June 2014 where
>
> 1. All PSVs must implement cashless paymeny system for bus fare
>
> 2. All PSVs to be fit with fleet management systems where overspeeding
>
> will be checked from system logs, not on speed cameras
>
> 3. All PSVs to have surveillance cameras to reduce carjackings, petty
>
> crimes, and terrorism
>
> 4. Install digital speed governors
>
>
> This will see Beba Pay and Mpesa fight for supremacy. I'm keen to see
>
> what card Safaricom has on it's deck. This is a great opportunity for
>
> payment system innovators to comeup with exciting products, and also
>
> for fleet management system companies to have regular work. The
>
> commuters on the other hand will dig dipper in their pockets to pay
>
> for the services.
>
>
> And finally, the government has a way of collecting taxes on the Ksh
>
> 205 Billion industry
>
>
>
>
> http://mobile.nation.co.ke/business/New-law-on-technology-to-transform-PSV-sector/-/1950106/2134508/-/format/xhtml/-/5hut8qz/-/index.html
>
>
> --
>
> ______________________
>
> Mwendwa Kivuva, Nairobi, Kenya
>
> twitter.com/lordmwesh
>
> kenya.or.ke | The Kenya we know
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> kictanet mailing list
>
> kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke
>
> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
>
>
> Unsubscribe or change your options at
>
> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/ngigi%40at.co.ke
>
>
>
> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform
>
> for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and
>
> regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT
>
> sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and
> development.
>
>
> KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors
>
> online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth,
>
> share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do
>
> not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> kictanet mailing list
>
> kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke
>
> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
>
>
> Unsubscribe or change your options at
>
> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/mwangy%40gmail.com
>
>
> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform
>
> for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and
>
> regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT
>
> sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and
> development.
>
>
> KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors
>
> online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth,
>
> share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do
>
> not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
>
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Regards,
>
>
> Mark Mwangi
>
>
> markmwangi.me.ke
>
> -------------- next part --------------
>
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
>
> URL: <
> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/pipermail/kictanet/attachments/20140105/8756c067/attachment-0001.html
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
>
> Message: 2
>
> Date: Sun, 05 Jan 2014 18:33:58 +0300
>
> From: Watila Alex <awatila at yahoo.co.uk>
>
> To: Ngigi Waithaka <ngigi at at.co.ke>
>
> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke>
>
> Subject: Re: [kictanet] PSVs required to fit cameras, implement
>
> cashless payment, and fleet management systems
>
> Message-ID: <52C97B66.9010006 at yahoo.co.uk>
>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"; Format="flowed"
>
>
> smartbus tried cashless payments and they were always getting network
>
> errors.
>
>
> Is the required infrastructure in place and is it reliable enough to
>
> work all the time?
>
>
> regards,
>
>
> Alex
>
>
> On 01/05/2014 02:00 PM, Ngigi Waithaka wrote:
>
>
> The hubris of those in power...
>
>
> Show me who will implement this and I'll tell you whether this will
>
> work... We better re-invent a few Michuki's!
>
>
> On a more fundamental level isn't forcing Kenyans to use a certain
>
> form of payment over others a violation of our rights to use The
>
> Kenyan Currency in our transactions?
>
>
> Can you deny a Kenyan a fundamental service such as transport if they
>
> presented to you valid legal tender in hard currency in Ksh?
>
>
> Waithaka Ngigi
>
>
> Alliance Technologies
>
> Nairobi, Kenya
>
>
> www.A1.io <http://www.A1.io>
>
>
> On 5 Jan 2014 13:21, "Kivuva" <Kivuva at transworldafrica.com
>
> <mailto:Kivuva at transworldafrica.com <Kivuva at transworldafrica.com>>> wrote:
>
>
> A new law to regulate the public transport has been put in place and
>
> will take effect by June 2014 where
>
> 1. All PSVs must implement cashless paymeny system for bus fare
>
> 2. All PSVs to be fit with fleet management systems where overspeeding
>
> will be checked from system logs, not on speed cameras
>
> 3. All PSVs to have surveillance cameras to reduce carjackings, petty
>
> crimes, and terrorism
>
> 4. Install digital speed governors
>
>
> This will see Beba Pay and Mpesa fight for supremacy. I'm keen to see
>
> what card Safaricom has on it's deck. This is a great opportunity for
>
> payment system innovators to comeup with exciting products, and also
>
> for fleet management system companies to have regular work. The
>
> commuters on the other hand will dig dipper in their pockets to pay
>
> for the services.
>
>
> And finally, the government has a way of collecting taxes on the Ksh
>
> 205 Billion industry
>
>
>
> http://mobile.nation.co.ke/business/New-law-on-technology-to-transform-PSV-sector/-/1950106/2134508/-/format/xhtml/-/5hut8qz/-/index.html
>
>
> --
>
> ______________________
>
> Mwendwa Kivuva, Nairobi, Kenya
>
> twitter.com/lordmwesh <http://twitter.com/lordmwesh>
>
> kenya.or.ke <http://kenya.or.ke> | The Kenya we know
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> kictanet mailing list
>
> kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke <mailto:kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke<kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke>
> >
>
> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
>
>
> Unsubscribe or change your options at
>
> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/ngigi%40at.co.ke
>
>
> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder
>
> platform for people and institutions interested and involved in
>
> ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst
>
> for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT
>
> enabled growth and development.
>
>
> KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable
>
> behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's
>
> times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or
>
> personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your
>
> wares or qualifications.
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> kictanet mailing list
>
> kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke
>
> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
>
>
> Unsubscribe or change your options at
> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/awatila%40yahoo.co.uk
>
>
> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform
> for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and
> regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT
> sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
>
>
> KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors
> online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth,
> share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do
> not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
>
>
> -------------- next part --------------
>
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
>
> URL: <
> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/pipermail/kictanet/attachments/20140105/1b020155/attachment-0001.html
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
>
> Message: 3
>
> Date: Sun, 5 Jan 2014 17:21:12 +0100
>
> From: kris njoroge <krsnjo at gmail.com>
>
> To: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke>
>
> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke>
>
> Subject: Re: [kictanet] PSVs required to fit cameras, implement
>
> cashless payment, and fleet management systems
>
> Message-ID:
>
> <CAK37A+KCp=PvS1hVqB-qT196srAty0n-U8LsuNuOgKGiLBDtqQ at mail.gmail.com>
>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
>
> I totally agree with Mark. Public transport has and should always be looked
>
> at as a service of the government to the masses. Cameras and payment
>
> systems are just means of putting money into the pockets of a few companies
>
> or individuals and as such do not really help solve the problem. Think if
>
> the sector was run as a non profit (and in a sustainable manner) all would
>
> leave there cars at home and use the system. As we move forward think the
>
> thought of companies running the sector on commission of the government
>
> would also work. Auction off a licence 2-5 year to run the sector on behalf
>
> of the gov or counties with well laid out goals and guidelines as
>
> benchmarks. Off course infrastructure has to be put in place first like bus
>
> lanes everywhere, bus stops away from the main roads (thika rd and mombasa
>
> rd should not have bus stops) in short better planning.
>
>
>
> On Sun, Jan 5, 2014 at 4:33 PM, Watila Alex <awatila at yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
>
> smartbus tried cashless payments and they were always getting network
>
> errors.
>
>
> Is the required infrastructure in place and is it reliable enough to work
>
> all the time?
>
>
> regards,
>
>
> Alex
>
>
>
> On 01/05/2014 02:00 PM, Ngigi Waithaka wrote:
>
>
> The hubris of those in power...
>
>
> Show me who will implement this and I'll tell you whether this will
>
> work... We better re-invent a few Michuki's!
>
>
> On a more fundamental level isn't forcing Kenyans to use a certain form of
>
> payment over others a violation of our rights to use The Kenyan Currency in
>
> our transactions?
>
>
> Can you deny a Kenyan a fundamental service such as transport if they
>
> presented to you valid legal tender in hard currency in Ksh?
>
>
> Waithaka Ngigi
>
>
> Alliance Technologies
>
> Nairobi, Kenya
>
>
> www.A1.io
>
> On 5 Jan 2014 13:21, "Kivuva" <Kivuva at transworldafrica.com> wrote:
>
>
> A new law to regulate the public transport has been put in place and
>
> will take effect by June 2014 where
>
> 1. All PSVs must implement cashless paymeny system for bus fare
>
> 2. All PSVs to be fit with fleet management systems where overspeeding
>
> will be checked from system logs, not on speed cameras
>
> 3. All PSVs to have surveillance cameras to reduce carjackings, petty
>
> crimes, and terrorism
>
> 4. Install digital speed governors
>
>
> This will see Beba Pay and Mpesa fight for supremacy. I'm keen to see
>
> what card Safaricom has on it's deck. This is a great opportunity for
>
> payment system innovators to comeup with exciting products, and also
>
> for fleet management system companies to have regular work. The
>
> commuters on the other hand will dig dipper in their pockets to pay
>
> for the services.
>
>
> And finally, the government has a way of collecting taxes on the Ksh
>
> 205 Billion industry
>
>
>
>
> http://mobile.nation.co.ke/business/New-law-on-technology-to-transform-PSV-sector/-/1950106/2134508/-/format/xhtml/-/5hut8qz/-/index.html
>
>
> --
>
> ______________________
>
> Mwendwa Kivuva, Nairobi, Kenya
>
> twitter.com/lordmwesh
>
> kenya.or.ke | The Kenya we know
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> kictanet mailing list
>
> kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke
>
> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
>
>
> Unsubscribe or change your options at
>
> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/ngigi%40at.co.ke
>
>
> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform
>
> for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and
>
> regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT
>
> sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and
> development.
>
>
> KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors
>
> online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth,
>
> share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do
>
> not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> kictanet mailing listkictanet at lists.kictanet.or.kehttps://
> lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
>
>
>
> Unsubscribe or change your options at
> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/awatila%40yahoo.co.uk
>
>
>
> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform
> for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and
> regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT
> sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
>
>
> KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors
> online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth,
> share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do
> not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> kictanet mailing list
>
> kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke
>
> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
>
>
> Unsubscribe or change your options at
>
> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/krsnjo%40gmail.com
>
>
> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform
>
> for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and
>
> regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT
>
> sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and
> development.
>
>
> KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors
>
> online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth,
>
> share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do
>
> not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
>
>
>
>
>
> --
>
>
> *If the human brain were so simple that we could understand it, we would be
>
> so simple that we couldn't. - Emerson M. Pugh*
>
> -------------- next part --------------
>
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
>
> URL: <
> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/pipermail/kictanet/attachments/20140105/751ff8cf/attachment.html
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
>
> Subject: Digest Footer
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> kictanet mailing list
>
> kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke
>
> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
>
> End of kictanet Digest, Vol 80, Issue 30
>
> ****************************************
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> kictanet mailing list
> kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke
> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
>
> Unsubscribe or change your options at
> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/info%40alyhussein.com
>
>
> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform
> for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and
> regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT
> sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
>
> KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors
> online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth,
> share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do
> not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> kictanet mailing list
> kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke
> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
>
> Unsubscribe or change your options at
> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/ngigi%40at.co.ke
>
> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform
> for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and
> regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT
> sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
>
> KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors
> online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth,
> share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do
> not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
>
--
*Regards,*
*Wait**haka Ngigi*
Chief Executive Officer | Alliance Technologies | MCK Nairobi Synod Building
T + 254 (0) 20 2333 471 |Office Mobile: +254 786 28 28 28 | M + 254 737 811
000
www.at.co.ke
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/pipermail/kictanet/attachments/20140107/367c4b84/attachment.htm>
More information about the KICTANet
mailing list