[kictanet] [ke-internetusers] Re: PS Ndemo, ECONET Scandal aand Vested Interests

Tue Oct 14 00:29:45 EAT 2008

JohnI listened to Dr Ndemo explaining how advanced India and Malaysia,
Singapore, Taiwan and Hong Kong are - the so called Tigers. And then in the
next breath he started talking about FDI and Equity Bank. I started
wondering what exactly is hailing Kenya. There is evidence that kikulacho
kinguoni yetu.

Any simple economic theorists will explain what is going on in Kenya. Dr
Ndemo who is an economist can explain the life cycle of development.

I am afraid, they will issue these licences, they will build it and no one
will come. This has to be a mobilization effort from all of us. We can not
allow them to give away our birth right.

Joe

On Mon, Oct 13, 2008 at 4:14 PM, John Maina <j.maina at ymail.com> wrote:

> Fello Kenyans
>
> I am actually amazed by what PS Ndemo is trying to do with the assistance
> of some people who are just out to make a quick kill.
>
> I was at the Strathmore ICT conference and was suprised the way PS Ndemo
> was actually talking about what he does not practise. PS Ndemo talked about
> the students participating in start ups and also being assisted in business
> incubationn.
>
> How can students from Kenya be innovators when all business investments are
> supposed to be owned by foreigners? I listened to Mr Paul Kukubo who rushed
> to the defense of private sector when one of the participant asked CBA,
> Safariicom, and other private companies what they were doing to assist
> students in achieving dreams and nurturing innovation.
>
> Paul Kukubo, instead of leaving the private sectoor to answer, rushed to
> their defence and said that the private sector cannot do that because they
> are not venture capitalist. So sad Kenyans. So sad when you hear that. There
> is a clause of CSR on the business lincense whicch these companies are given
> and when Paul rush to defend companies then you realise what kind of mess we
> are in.
>
> I have nothing against Paul and really admire his work but let me tell you
> Kamotho, Alex, Maina, and all that our children and us cannot be innovators
> and good investors when we buildd the mentality that the foreigners are the
> best. The people who pose as the foreigners are actually local corrupt
> officials and so opportunity must be given equally.
>
> The said foreigners all come and borrow in Kenyan banks and use Kenyan
> expertise and those who have trried to use pure foreign expertise have
> failed. Kenyans lets wake up and stop seeing our children and ourselves as
> stupid. We are smart and caan make it and KICTANET should support us on this
> and not stop the people who expose cons. The cons in ICT must be stopped on
> their tracks. Njeri Rionge, Kukubo, Dr Adera, Gilda, Alice Kinyua, bernard
> Kioko, Moses Kemobaro are all local guys really setting up the pace and
> trend in ICt in this country.
>
> They didd what they did because they were given a chance. We must stop Dr
> Ndemo from giving foreigners exclusive righst in ripping this country. We
> have no apologies for the crooked people who have all thought that we can
> just spit on locals like Nick Nesbitt and Crystal watley have tried to do
> here. We dont owe Nick and Crystal anything. They owe us alot
>
> Regards
>
> JM
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: kamotho Njenga <kamothonjenga at gmail.com>
> To: j.maina at ymail.com
> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke>
> Sent: Monday, October 13, 2008 5:51:39 PM
> Subject: Re: [kictanet] [ke-internetusers] Re: PS Ndemo, ECONET Scandal
> aand Vested Interests
>
> Seems like the polemical arsenal and vitriol is now shifting towards my
> direction. I humbly rest my case on this issue. Another topic might be a
> better idea for us.
>
>
> Kamotho Njenga
>
> On Sat, Oct 11, 2008 at 8:30 PM, <mwananchi at hushmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Kamotho,
>>
>> If the issues are too intertwined for you to follow then you should
>> say so and ask for simplification to enhance your ability to follow
>> through and distinguish what is what.
>>
>> Nonetheless, has PS Ndemo denied the occurrence of any the facts?
>> What PS Ndemo has, is a different interpretation of the facts and
>> how they took place. There is no issue personally with PS Ndemo,
>> what there are issues with are specific actions he is carrying out
>> while in his capacity as a public servant.
>>
>> - Ndemo admitted he signed an MOU with Libyans.
>>
>> - Ndemo admitted that before he left for Malaysia he made
>> pronouncements
>>  about changes in local shareholding requirements
>>
>> - Ndemo admitted he signed a "settlement agreement" with a certain
>>  foreign company
>>
>> - Ndemo admitted there are problems with current investment policies
>>
>> PS Ndemo is public servant who serves the Kenyan public not just
>> special interests in Kictanet. If other Wananchi have found it on
>> their own accord to forward discussions to other forums then do
>> your duty to take it up as an issue on those forums. As PS Ndemo
>> says, there is nothing to hide! In the same spirit of openness,
>> Ndemo's response has also been cross posted on other discussion
>> lists by other listers who saw it fit to do so.
>>
>> You see Kamotho, you've not presented a single iota of evidence or
>> fact, just empty rhetoric and belligerence. If you have any facts,
>> have conducted any investigations, gone to the relevant High Court
>> registrars, consulted the Attorney General, gone to archives to
>> determine whether what Ndemo said has been manufactured and
>> contradicts what has been shared here, then by all means speedily
>> share the documents and facts, debunk each specific fact and let
>> these matters be put to rest.
>>
>> PS Ndemo is free to start a lawsuit against the High Court of South
>> Africa, the High Court of Kenya and any other party all from which
>> the facts have been sourced from so that the same facts can be
>> gladly repeated and established under oath and public record. It is
>> however understandable that belligerent empty rhetoric seems to be
>> the only defence one can possibly turn to in a feeble attempt of
>> censorship when faced with indisputable facts. Good day.
>>
>> Peterson
>>
>>
>> On Sat, 11 Oct 2008 15:21:11 +0000 kamotho Njenga
>> <kamothonjenga at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >Friends,
>> >
>> >Beyond question, Kenyans have a right  to seek information as well
>> >clarity
>> >on any issue pertinent to the ICT sector.That right includes
>> >expressing
>> >views on matters where in ones opinion a route less than optimal
>> >in their
>> >opinion has been followed. The freedom of expression is not a
>> >preserve to
>> >any individual or group. But as a necessity such fundamental
>> >rights must be
>> >exercised within some confines of responsibility, propriety and
>> >decorum.
>> >
>> >Without over generalizing, this is the first time that allegations
>> >have been
>> >pursued with profundity, relentlessness and zeal of a unique
>> >magnitude and
>> >has been extended beyond KICTANET. For I have personally received
>> >similar
>> >messages in my other mail accounts that are not subscribed to this
>> >forum.
>> >The personalized overtones that have accompanied the pursuit of
>> >this matter
>> >whose goal is yet to be specified can neither be denied nor
>> >ignored.
>> >
>> >What is not in dispute is that the drivers of these allegations
>> >have their
>> >issues mixed up.At one point their claim is on MOUs, the next is
>> >on
>> >localization and at times its on "crooks" and so on. In a
>> >nutshell; alot of
>> >generalities and unguided missile whose clear intention is to
>> >finish
>> >somebody in one way or the other. Its so evident that there is an
>> >unwavering
>> >struggle to demonise the PS by depicting him in bad light. Since
>> >then, the
>> >PS has come out clearly on all points of accusations never mind
>> >that all the
>> >allegations are anchored on conjecture.
>> >
>> >On this basis and on the premise of objectivity, one canly
>> >conclude that the
>> >authors of these allegations are at best riding on the back of far
>> >fetched
>> >malice and wallowing entirely in the miasma of hollow vendetta.The
>> >alarmist
>> >tell tales (Whistle blowing/Whistling) should be dismissed with
>> >all the
>> >contempt they deserve.
>> >
>> >
>> >Kamotho Njenga
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >On Sat, Oct 11, 2008 at 6:12 AM, <mwananchi at hushmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >> Dear Eric,
>> >>
>> >> Some weekend reading for you, this article was directed at NEPAD
>> >> and the then Finance Minister and it covers some of the issues
>> >we
>> >> have been discussing.
>> >>
>> >> Africa, Kimunya should seek monetary policies that serve local
>> >> interests
>> >>
>> >http://www.bdafrica.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=8
>> >2
>> >>
>> >62&Itemid=5821<http://www.bdafrica.com/index.php?option=com_content
>> >&task=view&id=8262&Itemid=5821>
>> >>
>> >> "This, however, remains the quintessential question of African
>> >> development: how to achieve economic independence in an
>> >> international and regional context where the profit motives of
>> >most
>> >> investors and lenders rarely correspond to our growth and
>> >> development goals."
>> >>
>> >> We simply cannot achieve economic independence when over 80
>> >percent
>> >> of the economy is in the hands of foreigners more so non
>> >Africans
>> >> and PS Ndemo now wants to eliminate indigenous ownership
>> >> requirements. Local ownership requirements did not deter the
>> >> credible and serious Zain's, Vodafone's, France Telecom's,
>> >Altech's
>> >> of this world from coming into Kenya. Has PS Ndemo forgotten
>> >that
>> >> Kenya's FDI in the last year rose by over 1300 percent?
>> >>
>> >> Is it fair that some local individuals could use multiple
>> >separate
>> >> companies in which they have substantial shareholding so as to
>> >> maximize their effective share of TEAMS while other legitimate
>> >> local and international investors are locked out? These and
>> >other
>> >> criteria (total beneficial ownership etc) need to be looked at
>> >and
>> >> analysed to get to the core of the matter.
>> >>
>> >> It is a pity that PS Ndemo seems to believe that it is a bad
>> >thing
>> >> when Peterson asks the Government to listen to local investors
>> >and
>> >> take their interests into consideration while striking a balance
>> >in
>> >> the same way he listens to foreign investors and makes arbitrary
>> >> non-consultative policy changes just because the Nesbitt's of
>> >this
>> >> world (who already have a tax holiday) have already arm twisted
>> >him
>> >> behind closed doors into submission. We want these unnamed
>> >vested
>> >> interests to take their case to the Kenyan public and to stop
>> >> coercing public servants behind closed doors, if they can
>> >convince
>> >> the public openly that what they need is good for Kenya then the
>> >> public through their representatives will effect such changes
>> >> openly and transparently.
>> >>
>> >> As for the other matters, they don't require endorsement or
>> >> agreement, the facts stand on their own, they are facts anyone
>> >can
>> >> verify by going to the High Court registrar, providing the case
>> >> number and obtaining the same documents and rulings. The near
>> >> collapse and disrespect of our institutions is as a result of
>> >the
>> >> permeation and embrace of a culture of impunity. If these
>> >> institutions were respected by among others, PS Ndemo, it would
>> >not
>> >> be an issue affecting the nation.
>> >>
>> >> I challenge anyone with any contradicting documents to dispute
>> >the
>> >> facts by presenting the same rather than attempting to
>> >assassinate
>> >> the messenger for blowing the whistle.
>> >>
>> >> Have a good weekend.
>> >>
>> >> Regards,
>> >>
>> >> Peterson
>> >>
>> >> On Fri, 10 Oct 2008 15:38:36 +0000 "Eric M.K Osiakwan"
>> >> <emko at internetresearch.com.gh> wrote:
>> >> >Dear Peterson,
>> >> >
>> >> >I go with you on the wheel that the vested interest of the
>> >country
>> >> >in
>> >> >paramount.....
>> >> >
>> >> >The elements of my case though disappointing, i went with the
>> >> >established criteria since was applied across board but then in
>> >> >the
>> >> >situation where most of the local companies are majority owned
>> >by
>> >> >non-
>> >> >Africans, then one needs to look into the criteria again.
>> >> >
>> >> >The larger question, we need to raise is how do we ensure that
>> >the
>> >> >
>> >> >interest of other African investors can be unheld in another
>> >> >African
>> >> >jurisdiction, in the context of developing Africa by Africans.
>> >You
>> >> >
>> >> >know the TEAMS process is still ongoing so lets allow the
>> >> >establish
>> >> >procedures and policies to work, am patient and dont have any
>> >hard
>> >> >
>> >> >feelings at all.
>> >> >
>> >> >The other big question that we need to answer is, these huge
>> >> >infrastructure projects require huge sums of money, personally
>> >am
>> >> >not
>> >> >a deep pocket in that sense but at least i can raise the money,
>> >> >may
>> >> >be from another African country or worse case outside the
>> >> >continent
>> >> >if the amounts are way over. The TEAMS model where public funds
>> >> >are
>> >> >used to underwrite the risk in order to ensure that the entry
>> >> >barriers for investment are  minimised so local investors and
>> >> >entrepreneurs can participate are innovative and i personally
>> >want
>> >> >to
>> >> >give the TEAMS model a chance to succeed. We as Africans need
>> >to
>> >> >evolve solutions to our unique problems, ofcourse borrowing in
>> >> >same
>> >> >cases from others who have gone ahead.
>> >> >
>> >> >Unfortunately, i would have to distant myself from some of the
>> >> >allegations though you establish them on factual basis, it
>> >would
>> >> >be
>> >> >good for the right authorities to follow it through so that we
>> >> >have
>> >> >conclusive situations. Also, those involved must be given a
>> >chance
>> >> >to
>> >> >present their side of the argument so that those in this forum
>> >can
>> >> >be
>> >> >more knowledgable. Again, if we can keep it tactful, then the
>> >> >common
>> >> >good is preserved for the sake of posterity.
>> >> >
>> >> >Have a good weekend, good people.
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >On 10 Oct 2008, at 20:16, mwananchi at hushmail.com wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> >> Dear Eric,
>> >> >>
>> >> >> At the end of the day, Kenyans only want the best for our
>> >> >nation.
>> >> >> Kenyans certainly are not against beneficial foreign direct
>> >> >> investment and welcome it provided it is conducted under
>> >> >policies
>> >> >> that result in a win-win situation for Kenyans and the
>> >investor.
>> >> >> Unfortunately the country's policies particularly those being
>> >> >> fronted now do not reflect that wish, which is why it is
>> >> >important
>> >> >> that the Government pay attention to what local and would be
>> >> >> international investors are saying and strike a balance that
>> >is
>> >> >a
>> >> >> win-win for both.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> In your case, had PS Ndemo stuck with his proposal that he
>> >made
>> >> >in
>> >> >> 2007, Internet Research would not be experiencing any
>> >hurdles.
>> >> >The
>> >> >> local component would also have been preserved in a manner
>> >not
>> >> >> detrimental to your company.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> I hope that PS Ndemo will address the issue of your company.
>> >> >Kenya
>> >> >> as an African country should not be deterring Kenyan or any
>> >> >other
>> >> >> African investors who are credible and who operate and
>> >respect
>> >> >our
>> >> >> laws and institutions instead of trampling them underfoot and
>> >in
>> >> >> the one case that has been mentioned, deliberately failing to
>> >> >meet
>> >> >> their obligations for over 4 years. These are the same types
>> >of
>> >> >> investors who have been rejected by Altech, the nations of
>> >Papua
>> >> >> New Guinea, Malawi, Nigeria. The same characters who failed
>> >to
>> >> >meet
>> >> >> their licence obligations for years in New Zealand and were
>> >> >lucky
>> >> >> to get token percentage ownership of what was left when
>> >credible
>> >> >> investors took over and who in Lesotho have been engaged in
>> >tax
>> >> >and
>> >> >> roaming link frauds.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> http://rapidshare.com/files/152715858/fraud_in_lesotho.pdf
>> >> >>
>> >> >> They finally found a safe haven to land in Kenya embraced by
>> >a
>> >> >> culture of impunity where it does not matter if you meet your
>> >> >> obligations or if you operate with cancelled licences
>> >provided
>> >> >> powerful vested interests pave and coerce the way for you.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> When we reject investors whom we know such as Eric and
>> >embrace
>> >> >> undesirable investors instead, it shows why we precisely are
>> >> >> lagging behind in FDI. Indeed if Kenya gave investors 5 years
>> >as
>> >> >it
>> >> >> did in this particular case to pay licencing fees, the
>> >country
>> >> >> would be overwhelmed with numerous investors. As the
>> >occassion
>> >> >of
>> >> >> Moi Day graces us today, the Moi government despite its many
>> >> >flaws
>> >> >> was quick to realize what type of animal this was and
>> >correctly
>> >> >> rejected them not just once but twice.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Peterson
>> >> >>
>> >> >> On Fri, 10 Oct 2008 03:31:48 +0000 "Eric M.K Osiakwan"
>> >> >> <emko at internetresearch.com.gh> wrote:
>> >> >>> Dear Peterson,
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>> Thanks for establishing a set of facts and am sure the right
>> >> >>> people
>> >> >>> would respond to the issues you have riased. I hope the
>> >> >discussion
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>> would continue on a factual basis and not degenerate.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>> I want to also present one set of facts regarding my
>> >> >participation
>> >> >>> in
>> >> >>> the TEAMS project. My company, Internet Research went
>> >through
>> >> >the
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>> entire process and indeed qualified to be allocated shares
>> >but
>> >> >at
>> >> >>> one
>> >> >>> of the proposed shareholders meeting, the issue of local
>> >> >ownership
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>> came up.
>> >> >>>
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> Learn from the comfort of your home.  Choose your degree and
>> >receive a free
>> >> info pak.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >http://tagline.hushmail.com/fc/Ioyw6h4eS5zglpKiYQ1E4QV7ya3V7OQilSPt
>> >QZA6nTe5QdbJulIxcO/
>> >>
>> >>
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