[kictanet] Legislation and Regulation for e-Commerce in Kenya

Brian Munyao Longwe blongwe at gmail.com
Wed Jul 9 19:31:54 EAT 2008 

Actually if my memory serves me right. KIF is KEPSAs "child" i.e when  
KEPSA decided to have sector clusters KIF was established *by* KEpsa  
to act as the umbrella for ICT private sector.

But I stand to be corrected if I'm getting my facts wrong. But if I am  
right then it *is* important for any critics to understand the inner  
workings by visiting.

I am urging action instead of just talk.

Brian

Sent from my iPhone

On 09 Jul 2008, at 6:39 PM, "waudo siganga" <emailsignet at mailcan.com>  
wrote:

> Hi Brian - I do not think that the issue is an interest in the  
> internal
> operations of KIF. We are talking governance in the context of KEPSA/ 
> KIF
> relationship, something also of interest to the consumer community.  
> For
> your information last year all stakeholders held a meeting in KEPSA  
> and
> decided to open membership to all interested Private Sector
> associations. This was after it was observed that the hitherto
> stranglehold on KEPSA by KIF meant that the sector was not adequately
> represented. Some people may have felt unhappy or even insecure with
> this development. The problem is that my friend Kevit, being the KEPSA
> ICT director uses his position to constantly market KIF as if it is a
> favoured player in KEPSA (e.g. "I would like to confirm that the
> KEPSA/KIF relationship is vibrant." - as if implying the other
> associations are dead) He is often busy promoting "KIF Positions"
> instead of "KEPSA Positions" including using KIF letterheads at the
> MSFs. I have misgivings about the current ICT leadership in KEPSA  
> but I
> am hopeful things will change.
>
> Waudo
>
> On Wed, 9 Jul 2008 16:54:41 +0300, "Brian Munyao Longwe"
> <blongwe at gmail.com> said:
>> Hi Alex,
>>
>> I would find it hard to imagine how much more Kevit can explain to  
>> you
>> about KIF.
>>
>> I would like to suggest that Kevit extend an invitation to you (and
>> anyone else who might be interested/concerned) to attend the next KIF
>> meeting as an observer and see/feel the animal yourself.
>>
>> Brian
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On 09 Jul 2008, at 3:45 PM, Alex Gakuru <alex.gakuru at yahoo.com>  
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Kevit:
>>>
>>> I am afraid you have not clarified well enough. I shall not ask you
>>> further KEPSA questions although on your previous email you told
>>> Waundo "As the director of KEPSA  I welcome CSK and any other
>>> association to full membership of KEPSA." Apparently this now
>>> appears to have changed. And I doubt Waundo complained of
>>> "exclusion" not of his private self, rather of CSK? I could be wrong
>>> but he could clarify.
>>>
>>> On Jun 23, 2008 it was announced that a "Local Software Industry
>>> Association established" with, among others, "3.1 Objective, Market
>>> the local software industry to venture capitalists." (see
>>> announcement document attached) Was it registered under Societies  
>>> Act
>>> ( Read Public interest) or as Private (non-or-for-profit) Company? I
>>> found it strange it was formed 3 days to aour very successful and
>>> OPEN BarCamp. Is this one also under your umbrella?
>>>
>>> On the links you sent onlist:
>>>
>>> www.innovation-africa.net
>>>
>>> Domain Name: INNOVATION-AFRICA.NET
>>>  Registrar: TUCOWS INC.
>>>  Whois Server: whois.tucows.com
>>>  Referral URL: http://domainhelp.opensrs.net
>>>  Name Server: ULTRA103.UK2.NET
>>>  Name Server: ULTRA104.UK2.NET
>>>  Status: redemptionPeriod
>>>  Updated Date: 24-jun-2008
>>>  Creation Date: 14-may-2007
>>>  Expiration Date: 14-may-2008
>>>
>>> I tried www.innovation-africa.co.ke >> was re-directing to >> www.kif.or.ke
>>> ( but today it now says "under construction") I gather Centurion
>>> Systems offices accommodates KIF, is that correct?
>>>
>>> What I am trying is to understand is who speaks in the background
>>> when when "KIF" issues "stakeholders" statements on an issue,how
>>> representative or public service-oriented, good governance, in
>>> trying to understand new and old associations' motives.
>>>
>>> With above information, it would clear doubts of public policy
>>> participation illegitimacy or inappropriate public procurement
>>> involvement(s). For the sake of our growing transparent ICTs
>>> abundantly rewarding enterprising citizens.
>>>
>>>
>>> Alex
>>>
>>>
>>> --- On Wed, 7/9/08, kevit desai <kevit at centurionsystemsltd.com>  
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> From: kevit desai <kevit at centurionsystemsltd.com>
>>>> Subject: RE: [kictanet] Legislation and Regulation for e-Commerce
>>>> in Kenya
>>>> To: alex.gakuru at yahoo.com
>>>> Cc: "'kictanet-lists'" <kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke>
>>>> Date: Wednesday, July 9, 2008, 2:50 AM
>>>> Hi Alex,
>>>>
>>>> I'm pleased to clarify as much as I can.
>>>>
>>>> Kepsa has an open membership of PRIVATE sector industry and
>>>> market segment
>>>> associations in almost all economic sectors. Independence:
>>>> KEPSA decisions
>>>> are dependent on members wishes, and members are drawn from
>>>> the private
>>>> sector. In fact, NGO's are not approached for
>>>> membership in KEPSA, neither
>>>> are government bodies including parastatals. KIF follows
>>>> the same approach
>>>> for membership and decision-making. No NGO's and
>>>> government agencies are
>>>> member ofn KIF. However, KEPSA and KIF consult on a REGULAR
>>>> BASIS with all
>>>> those stakeholders. Having said that, KEPSA and KIF have no
>>>> obligation to
>>>> offer service to non members.
>>>>
>>>> Hopefully this helps to clarify. Do get in touch with Sam
>>>> Mwaura of KEPSA or
>>>> Marcel Werner of KIF.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Kevit
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Alex Gakuru [mailto:alex.gakuru at yahoo.com]
>>>> Sent: 09 July 2008 04:45
>>>> To: kevit desai
>>>> Cc: kictanet-lists
>>>> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Legislation and Regulation for
>>>> e-Commerce in Kenya
>>>>
>>>> Kevit,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> How does KEPSA and KIF governance relate ensuring decisions
>>>> independence?
>>>> The political issue here may be monopolization to the
>>>> extent of clouding out
>>>> other actors thereby generating conflict. The Motive Theory
>>>> steps in.
>>>>
>>>> We investigate the effects of competition on subjects'
>>>> attitude towards
>>>> cooperation. Three groups face three economic environments
>>>> with different
>>>> degrees of competition, from a benchmark case with no
>>>> competition at all up
>>>> to a perfect competition case. Subjects contribute
>>>> generously to a public
>>>> project in the absence of competition, whereas they
>>>> contribute very little
>>>> in the presence of a maximum degree of competition. A
>>>> diminishing attitude
>>>> towards cooperation clearly emerges as the degree of
>>>> competition increases.
>>>> Therefore, if cooperation does enhance well-being, the
>>>> maximum degree of
>>>> competition may be not efficient.
>>>>
>>>> <http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/B6W5H-4N0GDV1-1/2/fb32f4c6e9ba
>>>> 6a6f51d7da9d40d806eb>
>>>>
>>>> react.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --- On Tue, 7/8/08, kevit desai
>>>> <kevit at centurionsystemsltd.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> From: kevit desai
>>>> <kevit at centurionsystemsltd.com>
>>>>> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Legislation and Regulation for
>>>> e-Commerce in Kenya
>>>>> To: alex.gakuru at yahoo.com
>>>>> Cc: secretariat at kif.or.ke, "'KICTAnet ICT
>>>> Policy Discussions'"
>>>> <kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke>
>>>>> Date: Tuesday, July 8, 2008, 1:14 PM
>>>>> Hi Waudo,
>>>>>
>>>>> As the director of KEPSA  I welcome CSK and any other
>>>>> association to full
>>>>> membership of KEPSA. We look forward to a meaningful
>>>>> partnership.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Kevit Desai
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _____
>>>>>
>>>>> From: waudo siganga [mailto:emailsignet at mailcan.com]
>>>>> Sent: 08 July 2008 13:55
>>>>> To: Kevit Desai
>>>>> Cc: secretariat at kif.or.ke; 'KICTAnet ICT Policy
>>>>> Discussions'
>>>>> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Legislation and Regulation for
>>>>> e-Commerce in Kenya
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Hello Kevit - I think one needs to be careful when
>>>> handling
>>>>> KEPSA and KIF at
>>>>> the same time. Do not use your foothold in KEPSA to
>>>> promote
>>>>> KIF at the
>>>>> expense of other associations. The explanation is very
>>>>> simple: KEPSA was
>>>>> formed as a focal point, a bringing together
>>>> characterised
>>>>> by INCLUSIVITY.
>>>>> KIF on the other hand is an independent association
>>>> and the
>>>>> nature of such
>>>>> an association is EXCLUSIVITY (through membership
>>>>> mechanism). I would like
>>>>> to see the promotion of more associations on the KEPSA
>>>> ICT
>>>>> Board, not just
>>>>> KIF. Please give us space.
>>>>>
>>>>> Waudo
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, 8 Jul 2008 11:07:07 +0300, "Kevit
>>>> Desai"
>>>>> <kevit at centurionsystemsltd.com> said:
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi Alex,
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> KEPSA (info at kepsa.or.ke): private sector policy body
>>>> with
>>>>> its own governance
>>>>> structure. Elected as a director in private capacity
>>>> and as
>>>>> KIF vice
>>>>> chairman.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> KIF (secretariat at kif.or.ke): membership-based industry
>>>>> association, member
>>>>> of KEPSA's ICT section. Elected as vice-chairman.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Centurion Systems Ltd: (www.centurionsystemsltd.com)
>>>>> private company,
>>>>> director, member of KIF.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Director of Engineering - Centurion Systems Ltd
>>>>>
>>>>> Chairperson IEEE - Kenya Section
>>>>>
>>>>> Chairperson - Engineering Students Exhibition
>>>>>
>>>>> Governor - KEPSA
>>>>>
>>>>> Director - KEPSA
>>>>>
>>>>> Director - Innovation Africa
>>>>>
>>>>> Director- Kenya ICT Board
>>>>>
>>>>> Vice Chairman - Kenya ICT Federation
>>>>>
>>>>> BOA - AIESEC
>>>>>
>>>>> Member - National Strategy for University Education
>>>>>
>>>>> Co-ordinator - Growing Sustainable Business(GSB)-UNDP
>>>> Kenya
>>>>>
>>>>> General Co-Chair - Africon 2009
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> 2nd Fl, New Rehema Hse,
>>>>>
>>>>> Raphta Rd
>>>>>
>>>>> , Westlands -Nairobi
>>>>>
>>>>> P.O. BOX 66031 - 00800 Nrb.
>>>>>
>>>>> Tel:+254 20 4440102/3 Fax: +254 20 4440104 CDMA: 020
>>>>> 2049750
>>>>>
>>>>> Mobile: +254 722 517067
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.centurionsystemsltd.com
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.ieee.org
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.engineeringexhibition.co.ke
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.innovation-africa.net
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.kepsa.or.ke
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.powerup.co.ke
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.aiesec.org
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.africon2007.co.za
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.kif.or.ke
>>>>>
>>>>> htpp://www.ict.go.ke
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.globalcompact.org
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.undp.org/business/gsb
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: waudo siganga [mailto:emailsignet at mailcan.com]
>>>>> Sent: Monday, July 07, 2008 9:40 PM
>>>>> To: kevit desai
>>>>> Cc: secretariat at kif.or.ke; 'KICTAnet ICT Policy
>>>>> Discussions'
>>>>> Subject: RE: [kictanet] Legislation and Regulation for
>>>>> e-Commerce in Kenya
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Hello Kevit - Since you sent this message to KICTANET
>>>> I can
>>>>> answer it on
>>>>>
>>>>> the same forum. I think the picture being painted
>>>> about a
>>>>> rosy situation
>>>>>
>>>>> including "collaboration" is simply not
>>>> true. The
>>>>> reason to  be frank is
>>>>>
>>>>> that there a few in your KIF who do not want any other
>>>>> association to
>>>>>
>>>>> have a voice in KEPSA or to interact with Government.
>>>> Could
>>>>> you as a
>>>>>
>>>>> KEPSA director ensure that all interested associations
>>>>> including the
>>>>>
>>>>> major ones not in KIF are allowed room to contribute
>>>> in
>>>>> KEPSA? It can be
>>>>>
>>>>> sad if you mis-use your position in KEPSA only to
>>>> promote
>>>>> KIF and crack
>>>>>
>>>>> down on those you feel are in the way.
>>>>>
>>>>> Waudo
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, 7 Jul 2008 21:02:31 +0300, "kevit
>>>> desai"
>>>>>
>>>>> <kevit at centurionsystemsltd.com> said:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Walu,
>>>>>
>>>>>> Associations are welcome to be members of KEPSA.
>>>> I
>>>>> would like to confirm
>>>>>
>>>>>> that the KEPSA/KIF relationship is vibrant.  We
>>>> would
>>>>> like to do a lot
>>>>>
>>>>>> more
>>>>>
>>>>>> and welcome more support.
>>>>>
>>>>>> We appreciate Waudo's contributions at our
>>>> last
>>>>> ministerial stakeholder
>>>>>
>>>>>> forum.
>>>>>
>>>>>> Collaboration is the way forward.
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Kevit Desai
>>>>>
>>>>>> KEPSA Director
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>
>>>>>> From:
>>>>>
>>>> kictanet-bounces+kevit=centurionsystemsltd.com at lists.kictanet.or.ke
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> [mailto:kictanet-bounces+kevit=centurionsystemsltd.com at lists.kictanet.or.ke
>>>> ]
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Behalf Of waudo siganga
>>>>>
>>>>>> Sent: 07 July 2008 19:02
>>>>>
>>>>>> To: kevit at centurionsystemsltd.com
>>>>>
>>>>>> Cc: secretariat at kif.or.ke; KICTAnet ICT Policy
>>>>> Discussions
>>>>>
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Legislation and
>>>> Regulation for
>>>>> e-Commerce in
>>>>>
>>>>>> Kenya
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Walu - I am catching you loud and clear on
>>>> GPRS
>>>>> somewhere in the
>>>>>
>>>>>> bush. I did bring out the issue of regulating the
>>>> IT
>>>>> (or ICT) Profession
>>>>>
>>>>>> on this list a few months ago. But the rather
>>>>> unenthusiastic response I
>>>>>
>>>>>> got gave me the sense that possibly this was not
>>>> the
>>>>> correct list since
>>>>>
>>>>>> many of the subscribers appear just interested in
>>>> ICT
>>>>> Policy rather than
>>>>>
>>>>>> being actual IT Experts. Within the next two
>>>> weeks
>>>>> there will be another
>>>>>
>>>>>> list for professionals and you will be informed
>>>> (you
>>>>> have the
>>>>>
>>>>>> qualifications, don't you??). We are pushing
>>>> for a
>>>>> registration board
>>>>>
>>>>>> like thise done last yeaer for  nutritionists and
>>>>> Procurement
>>>>>
>>>>>> Practitioners. There is a lot of work going on
>>>>> unheralded. All we need
>>>>>
>>>>>> is a champion or chanpions in the right place.
>>>>>
>>>>>> Waudo
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Mon, 7 Jul 2008 02:45:53 -0700 (PDT),
>>>> "John
>>>>> Walubengo"
>>>>>
>>>>>> <jwalu at yahoo.com> said:
>>>>>
>>>>>>> Marcel,
>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>> It looks like quite some work has been
>>>> ongoing in
>>>>> this
>>>>>
>>>>>>> area...unfortunately it seems as if it was
>>>>> restricted within KIF only?
>>>>> I
>>>>>
>>>>>>> wonder if Computer Society of Kenya (CSK,
>>>> Waudo r
>>>>> u there?) or
>>>>>
>>>>>>> Information Security Audit & Control
>>>>> (ISACA-Kenya Chapter) just to
>>>>>
>>>>>>> mention some of the big IT Associations in
>>>> Kenya
>>>>> were involved. I beg to
>>>>>
>>>>>>> be enlightened.
>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>> This brings in an old question - who really
>>>>> represents the IT Profession
>>>>>
>>>>>>> in Kenya?  Shem has been on record as saying
>>>> that
>>>>> IT is the only
>>>>>
>>>>>>> discipline where we seem to lack bodies with
>>>> the
>>>>> same authority as LSK
>>>>>
>>>>>>> (Law Society of Kenya), IEK (Institute of
>>>>> Engineers of Kenya), Medical
>>>>>
>>>>>>> Practictioners Board amongst others to
>>>> regulate
>>>>> the IT Profession.
>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>> And by the way, KICTAnet does not fit the
>>>> bill
>>>>> either  (and has a
>>>>>
>>>>>>> different objective anyway).  But time has
>>>> come
>>>>> to really start thinking
>>>>>
>>>>>>> of regulating the IT profession, even as we
>>>>> struggle to regulate the
>>>>>
>>>>>>> industry...Ideally, CSK should take the lead
>>>> on
>>>>> this, but they have been
>>>>>
>>>>>>> awfully quite except when they award prizes
>>>> at
>>>>> the end of the year
>>>>> (Waudo
>>>>>
>>>>>>> I know u will kill me offline but I just had
>>>> to
>>>>> say it!).
>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>> KEPSA? very reputable and effective
>>>> particularly
>>>>> in the Manufacturing
>>>>>
>>>>>>> sector but on IT? am not sure they have been
>>>> as
>>>>> effective - particularly
>>>>>
>>>>>>> because the link between KEPSA/KIF and the
>>>> IT
>>>>> industry has been 'cloudy'
>>>>>
>>>>>>> for lack of a better word...Can for example
>>>> CSK
>>>>> or ISACA  be part of
>>>>>
>>>>>>> KEPSA without being part of KIF? I again
>>>> need to
>>>>> be enlightened.
>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>> O.K. I agree I did digress, but just
>>>> thinking
>>>>> loudly and saying that as
>>>>>
>>>>>>> we think of regulating electronic
>>>> transactions,
>>>>> we also need to
>>>>>
>>>>>>> simultaneously start regulating the IT
>>>>> profession..but maybe I am wrong.
>>>>>
>>>>>>> Particularly because regulation can and
>>>> often
>>>>> leads to suppression...
>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>> walu.
>>>>>
>>>>>>> --- On Sun, 7/6/08, Marcel Werner
>>>>> <marcelcwerner at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> From: Marcel Werner
>>>>> <marcelcwerner at gmail.com>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Subject: [kictanet] Legislation and
>>>>> Regulation for e-Commerce in Kenya
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> To: jwalu at yahoo.com
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Cc: secretariat at kif.or.ke,
>>>> "KICTAnet
>>>>> ICT Policy Discussions"
>>>>>
>>>>>> <kictanet at lists.kictanet.or.ke>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Date: Sunday, July 6, 2008, 6:43 PM
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Legislation and Regulation for
>>>> e-Commerce in
>>>>> Kenya
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Kenya ICT Federation (KIF) - Briefing
>>>> Note #
>>>>> 3  - Report -
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Public Panel 19
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> June 2008
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> *Electronic commerce (e-commerce) will
>>>> add
>>>>> at least one
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> percent point growth
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> to Kenya's overall economic growth
>>>>> within five years.
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> This is contingent
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> upon the adoption of legislation that
>>>>> supports electronic
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> transactions. *Kenya,
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> as an emerging economy and regional
>>>> leader,
>>>>> lags behind in
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> having a legal
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> framework for e-commerce in place. The
>>>>> current situation is
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> an anachronism
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> hampering national development, placing
>>>>> provincial centres
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> at a
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> disadvantage, and harming global
>>>>> competitiveness. Both
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> external and internal
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> trade require the new framework.The
>>>> Kenyan
>>>>> private sector
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> strongly supports
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> e-commerce legislation, as well as
>>>>> legislation of the
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Information and
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Communication Technology sector that
>>>>> guarantees an open
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> market and promotes
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> innovation.
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Why e-commerce law? Today, legislation
>>>>> supporting
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> electronic transactions
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> represents the single most powerful
>>>>> innovation opportunity
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> in the legal
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> framework of the ICT sector.
>>>> Legislation is
>>>>> needed to:
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -Legalize e-commerce transactions by
>>>>> recognizing an
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> electronic signature
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -Manage and control e-commerce r
>>> <KENYA SOFTWARE INDUSTRY ASSOCIATION.doc>
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>>
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